Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

Published 3 years ago by , Updated May 2nd, 2011 at 3:23 am,

superman action comics 900 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

So by now, unless you’re embarrassingly behind on your incredibly important pop culture news, you’ve probably already heard: Superman’s not an American anymore! Stop the presses! Call the fire department! Or – or – or something! However, the truth, as with most everything, is far murkier.

This whole ordeal arose from the nearly 100-page issue of Action Comics #900 that was released on Wednesday. Being a celebratory issue – indeed, 900 comics are a whole lot of comics – in addition to the main storyline by Paul Cornell, there are several back-up stories by various writers and even a storyboarded screenplay by Superman: The Movie director, Richard Donner.

The 9-page back-up story that set off the controversy in question, “The Incident,” was written by Man of Steel screenwriter David S. Goyer (who has also had at least some involvement with films like Nick Fury: Agent of Shield starring David Hasselhoff, Blade, Blade 2, Blade 3 (bleck), Batman Begins, Jumper, Ghost Rider, and so forth) and drawn by Miguel Sepulveda.

Here’s what you need to know about Goyer’s story before you decide whether or not to be livid about it:

  • Superman, not Clark Kent, stated his plans to renounce his American citizenship
  • Superman, not Clark Kent, stated his plans to renounce his citizenship because he doesn’t want his world-saving/interfering ways to be used against America anymore.
  • This was a back-up story written by David S. Goyer –  not a typical comic book writer.
  • This will probably never again be referenced, by Paul Cornell or anyone else at DC.
  • This back-up story might not even be in continuity.

superman renounces citizenship Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

If DC Comics wanted to actually change Superman’s citizenship in a serious, line-wide fashion, they wouldn’t have let David Goyer write it and it wouldn’t have been nine pages in the back of a milestone issue. They would’ve had one of their go-to writers do the job – maybe Paul Cornell, maybe Geoff Johns. It would’ve been its own storyline with every single major character (Batman, Flash, Green Lantern, Wonder Woman, Green Arrow, and so on) making an appearance to say something about, I don’t know — America.

Now, in my opinion, Superman is unequivocally an American icon. It doesn’t make you conservative or right-wing to believe this, because I’m about as liberal as they come and I believe it. By the same token, I don’t believe this was some leftwing conspiracy for Superman to reject America and all of its values; it would be hard for you to thoroughly examine the issue, the story, what was said by Superman, and come to that conclusion.

That said, the story in and of itself – “The Incident” – is pretty flawed. Controversy notwithstanding, it’s one of the more insignificant and arbitrary Superman comics I’ve read in a long while, and that’s saying something if you’ve read JMS’ short-lived Superman run from late last year about the man of tomorrow walking across America. David Goyer’s story references the Iranian protests from 2009 as if they happened yesterday (implying to me that it was written by Goyer back then and has been sitting around his apartment ever since). And yes, I’m aware that there have been Iranian protests since then, as early as two weeks ago even, but this comic seems to explicitly reference the 2009 protests.

Apparently, Superman reads the news, and he can’t stand seeing the Iranian leaders treat their people so deplorably. Fair enough. So, as an act of solidarity, he flies to Tehran and stands between the soldiers and the protestors for an entire 24 hours, letting them throw whatever they want at him in the process.

superman renounces citizenship 2 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

Long story short, the U.S. gets a lot of crap for this move. It’s perceived as an American-sponsored act, because obviously Superman represents “Truth, justice, the American way,” and so forth. Superman tells the President’s National Security Advisor that he plans to go to the U.N. and renounce his citizenship post-haste – this, he hopes, will free him up to do whatever he feels is necessary in the future, and in the process not have his actions reflect poorly upon the good, old U.S. of A.

After reading this story, my primary thought is this: Comic books creators just need to stop shoehorning real events into their comic books in an effort to make them more “important” like the “real world.” It’s rarely, if ever, done in any interesting or satisfying way and it almost always trivializes the events themselves. I’m reminded of the time Doctor Doom shed tears at Ground Zero after 9/11:

111 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

Amazing Spider-Man #36 (Doctor Doom) as drawn by John Romita Jr.

It’s a silly notion to suggest that Superman would go to Tehran and involve himself in the protests in any way whatsoever.  Superman is smarter than that. Hell, he’s got an advanced Kryptonian brain – he would know better than to wade into such a delicate situation without a second thought. In the end, the Iranian government doesn’t give-in to the protestors’ demands - an ending we already knew because it happened in real life. Regardless, as Superman’s flying away from Tehran, he spots a protestor reaching out with a flower in hand toward the soldier in front of him. The soldier takes the flower (oh, symbolism!), and Superman takes credit for this small but amazing development – he even brags about it to the National Security Advisor, which is, again, something Superman would never do in a million years.

superman renounces citizenship 3 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

superman renounces citizenship 4 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

In sum, the media, the Internet, everybody everywhere, have blown this whole situation way out of proportion. This isn’t (in my humble opinion) DC’s attempt to de-Americanize Superman as a character, and there’s no evidence that this story even belongs in DCU canon. I mean, just check out the visual progression of Superman through the years as drawn by Brian Stelfreeze (below) that appeared in the very pages of Action Comics #900. The rightmost iteration of Superman (in the style of the awesome Gary Frank) is the most modern of the six, and he’s the one waving the massive American flag. If David Goyer’s Superman renounced his Americanism, doesn’t this counteract that?

Click to enlarge:

the evolution of the man of tomorrow by brian stelfreeze 570x429 Did Superman REALLY Renounce His American Citizenship?

Instead, “The Incident” is just a terribly ham-fisted tale written by one David Goyer that fell flat on nearly every page. Frankly, we should be more concerned with the Man of Steel writer’s ability to write the character of Superman than whether or not he’s currently American.

Action Comics #900 has already sold out and will likely go back to a second printing. Overall, it’s pretty good – especially Paul Cornell’s work on the issue.

Follow me on twitter @benandrewmoore.

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TAGS: superman, superman man of steel

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  1. slow news days must be a b****.

    • Actually this has been a heated topic online and we thought it worthy of some editorial coverage.

      Vic

  2. you seem bitter

    • While I agree this seems to be more of a one shot, I think the story is isnt as bad as Ben makes it sound. However it does sound a bit bitter in terms of the way the article is read. Nothing personal, I enjoy the writing style but overall it seems pretty angry.lol

  3. ditto

    • on the slow news day…. that is

  4. It would actually be interesting if this was incorporated into the script for the forthcoming film, Man of Steel. It would be good if the film is based on current affairs and aside from fighting rogues gallery villains, Superman also battles a real world threat such as Al-Qaeda, the Taliban, Iranian extremists, North Korean extremists, Somali pirates, Colonel Muammar Gaddafi’s forces, etc while also rebelling against the West for their special interests.

    • Isn’t the point of Superman though? That there is all this violence and he cannot help everyone and falls short of protecting everyone. I’m not sure if Superman intervening would be a good idea. It sounds helpful, but would it be helpful for Superman to intervene in such a radical way? Definitely would be different and interesting.

  5. People are making too big of a deal about this.

  6. Why is this in Latest Movie News? :/

    • Well we do have an Off Topic category, but it still shows up under movie news on the home page. We focus on superhero movies and this has been a big buzz topic online so we thought we’d give our two cents on it.

      Vic

      • Fair enough, I guess.

        • Evengen,

          FYI, it’s currently the most popular article on the site. :)

          Vic

          • I’m not complaining, I just found it random =P Congrats for your article then :)

  7. Well this certainly shows the wonderful grasp Goyer has on the character. Are we all still looking forward to The Man Of Steel? Or are people starting to realise everybody involved in the project is totally wrong?

    On the subject of this, the story was put in there for one reason and one reason only, to create publicity. Nothing more, nothing less.

    • Actually, if it was there to get publicity, it would have been in the main story of the book. Not after several two-page back-up stories.

      • No, considering the amount of column inches it’s gotten, the length is hardly relevant.

        • Again, I say that results from overreaction. People will blow anything out of proportion if it will get them TV viewers, especially Fox News.

          • I agree. But it was still a publicity stunt designed to enrage debate.

          • Bah, I can’t believe I am doint this…

            FOX news doesnt need to blow anthing out of proportion for viewers. They get more viewers than CNN and MSNBC combined. I dont really like FOX (FNC) either but please get your facts straight before little attempts to push your political preference. It makes you look dumb otherwise. You can check ratings for any day but here is one for your viewing pleasure.

            Live + Same Day Cable News Daily Ratings for April 28, 2011

            Total Day
            FNC 1,141 259 531
            CNN 539 170 262
            MSNBC 501 149 239
            CNBC 219 52 110
            FBN 77 13 41
            HLN 219 89 123

            Wasnt this article supposed to be about Superman??

            • I think you probably just proved Brandon’s point.

  8. I can see Kimmel taking a jab at Welling denouncing his u.s. citizienship as a bit when Weeling appears May 12.

  9. I am glad someone finally took the time to really go over this. Several other sites have been all too eager to get the story out without doing their due diligence. For some reason the press (and I use that term loosely) is in an all fired hurry to get the story out, so they don’t get scooped. But in their hast they don’t research anything. Some of the better sites, mentioned that they did not know the context of the story. Just that it was in Issue #900.

    The fan up rising has been split along party lines. With many people attacking one another, over their respective political beliefs. They are attacking News organizations for their views. Many in the fan population have been screaming for DC’s blood.

    I understand how it can be difficult for companies to keep characters fresh. Several of DC’s characters have been around for atleast 70 years on a continuous bases. But too many times the ideas they try to use end up being written out in a few years. See “Death of Superman”, The Breaking of Batman, The Death of Batman, The Fall and then Death of “Green Lantern” I could go on and on.

    I think that DC needs to really sit down and think. Is what we are doing helping or hurting or product ?

  10. Please allow me a moment to make a rather long-winded rant.

    Superman is the most powerful being on the planet. In the age of instant information, where fact checking is done extremely after the case, I have to commend him on doing what he thinks is right. In fact, I agree with him. Does that make me a pinko commie? I don’t know, comrade. But, the comic even said that the US was almost pushed into war because he was there. So, imagine that you live in world with super-beings. And, just having one in the wrong place at the wrong time can spark off a war. Wouldn’t the moral obligation be to surrender one’s right to territory and declare themselves a neutral party? One who is for all nations, yet not beholden to one in particular?

    Also, in my opinion the true essence of Superman isn’t that he was an alien raised in America. To me, the true essence of Superman is that he was an alien raised as a human. Yes, he stood to defend, “truth, justice, and the American way.” But, what is the American way in the year 2011? Is it a blind faith in one’s country? Or, is it the ability to say call bull when things don’t seem right? There is no right answer, just like the political spectrum, it’s defined by how each individual perceives it. Yes, Superman is an American icon, he was created during one of worst economic crises and defined a generation. He inspired hope, change, and encouraged others to see the best in what humanity had to offer. Who are we to say that those ideals are only for Americans?

    Also, why just because this is written by David S. Goyer is the story instantly panned. As I recall, he and Robinson had brought back the JSA to be better than they had ever been before. He gets the characters, nuff said. Sorry for the length of the rant, I just needed to get that off my chest.

  11. I started reading the origins of Superman since I was a kid and understand How Superman became a different icon. The solution to that is “The Man of Steel” has moved on to the next Saga chapters what we ever heard of. In 1985 Crisis on Infinite Earths erased the whole origins of the DC Universe and established new incarnations of our Superheroes had started the legend from the beginning. This is what became a different legend. Crisis on Infinite Earths was the millenium holocaust which erased the legends.

  12. Anyone else find it ironic that this story is in the same issue as that double page evolution of The Man Of Tomorrow image, in which the most modern incarnation is holding an American flag?

  13. Who cares.

    • Alex,

      Google Superman American citizenship and you’ll see a hell of a lot of people care. It would have been more accurate for you to say “I don’t care.”

      Vic

      • Fair enough, Vic. It’s just typical America making a big deal out of something like this, only when it’s convenient to make an argument. I can’t believe I’m seeing this story everywhere.

        • Alex, I tend to agree. This story is way to important to too many people. This isnt important….no matter how popular it is.

  14. DSM, that could be DCs way saying
    “Ignore the story in the back”.
    Kind of makes you wonder though,
    Did Goyer write this becaue he intends to reference it in the film?

  15. Alex ,
    I do.

    • Why?

  16. Ben Moore,
    I appreciate your article in trying to set the Superman American citizenship renouncement straight. It gives me some hope that my favorite child hood superhero hasn’t been utterly ruined.

    Speaking as a paleo-conservative I think the problem with Superman’s “Truth, Justice and the American Way” has become really complicated due to our country’s foreign interventionism and (informal) empire. I have always believed the American way was minding our own business with freedom under the rule of law. It seems to me if Superman simply stands for that, the rest takes care of itself. So, I agree that the Superman writers need to quit interjecting Superman into international affairs that are none of our business because it only comes off as more American imperialism. But if imperialism is the American way now, and Superman is going to interject himself in Iranian affairs then perhaps he’s simply continuing to stand for the American way whether anybody likes it or not.

    • “So, I agree that the Superman writers need to quit interjecting Superman into international affairs that are none of our business because it only comes off as more American imperialism”

      Because Americans never interject themselves into international affairs huh?

      • Uh no. We interject ourselves all the time. Part of what I’m thinking about is when Singer had Perry White say, “… truth, justice and all that stuff” in Superman Returns. This while the US was being criticized around the world for being in Iraq. So the “American way” got left out because it was worried that it wouldn’t play very well internationally. I can understand that. I don’t like it though.

        If, for the sake of argument, America has lost its way via imperialism, then let Superman stand for non-interventionism in the affairs of foreign governments. The problem is Goyer fell right into the trap of having Superman do just that with the Iranian story line. In that regard, Superman is doing what US foreign policy does all the time.

        Superman doesn’t need to run from the American way, he ought to establish it. If we’ve strayed from it, then show us the way back by example. As Moore pointed out. Superman would never get involved in Iranian affairs, as presented by Goyer, in the first place.

      • DSM,

        You missed the entire point of his comment.

        Vic

    • iakobos,

      Well said, bud. “American way” means core American values, not what the government is doing at any given time. It means exactly what you stated above – it’s not complicated at all.

      Vic

  17. I honestly didn’t even read the stories in the back of the issue, just read the black ring conclusion in the shop.
    I assumed it was common knowledge that hardly anything that could be considered canon ever happens in these milestone ministories.
    This definetly just got blown out of proportion.

    • Can’t say I agree with that, reading it in the shop, just buy the damned thing. These writers and artists rely on cash coming in ya know.

      • So nobody should read a comic book in a comic book shop? Doesn’t make a whole load of sense.

        Hell, have you even been to a comic book store?

        • agreed. that’s like saying you cant read a book at “books a million”. it happens every day all day.

  18. You have to realize that Marvel and DC both live in a world that is similar to ours, which is why real world events are also introduced into the comic books. It has always been like and if you’re just now noticing that, than you probably shouldn’t be covering anything comic book related.

    Personally i’ve never enjoyed DC comics so I wouldn’t know anything about this recent Superman news, but it doesn’t sound like it is anything I would ever go nuts over. Superman is from krypton after all so it is kinda obvious something like this would happen eventually.

  19. The following was my posted response to Nautius in the Green Lantern/Star Wars thread, regarding his anger about this story. The linked website I refer to is that comicalliance.com (sp?) which Nautius originally mentioned. This was the first of three responses on the matter that I put in three different threads.

    With respect to all of those who disliked this story either because of its message(s) (whether implied or outright stated) or because of their perception of the story’s quality as a written piece, I thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought it was well-written (not perfect, but well put-together) and I very much agreed with the message(s). I found it to be right in line with what Superman is (as well as who).

    I don’t normally repost my messages, but I wanted my thoughts to be represented in this forum, since it obviously mattered to me.

    Without further ado:

    Nautius…

    I read the entire story, and Superman does not DEnounce his American citizenship OR America, itself. He REnounces his citizenship (or states he is going to do so) precisely because he does not want America to be blamed for any of his actions. In this case, the action was not even anything bad, explicitly OR implicitly. He stood there in the middle of the potential battlefield and did nothing against either side, including when the pro-government gatherees began throwing Molotov cocktails at him (granted, they could not actually hurt him that way, BUT he didn’t even give them a disapproving look, much less react in any other way obviously open to him).

    He also admitted to the official chastising him in that excerpt you saw that he HAD made a mistake assuming that the Iranian government would simply view him as acting on his own; THEN, he gave the line that apparently angers you.

    Here’s the thing: Superman upset so many people (read some of the absolutely assinine comments posted on that comicsalliance.com page after the article) by doing EXACTLY WHAT WE ALL EXPECT HIM TO DO…supporting a questioning group’s right to demand better from its government WITHOUT interfering in their affairs OR those of the very government they’re questioning/protesting. On top of that, he tries, as always (as much as he is able in any given situation), to satisfy everyone by making sure the U.S. government knows he will not cause them such political difficulties again. He does what he’s always done–he takes care of the problem.

    Isn’t THAT attitude what makes America the hope of so many around the world? Yes.

  20. Jor El: Live as one of them, Kal-El, to discover where your strength and your power are needed. Always hold in your heart the pride of your special heritage. They can be a great people, Kal-El, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way. For this reason above all, their capacity for good, I have sent them you… my only son.

    Jonathan: You could be the world’s greatest superhero or it’s most mild mannered citizen.

  21. This was a ham-fisted attempt for the writers to interject their personal politics into the Super-man story.

    If Superman ever had an issue with an American policy, he (as all Americans can) simply state that he does not support that particular action. And he could be as vocal about it as he wants. Because it’s an American right.

    This was just another cynical attempt for some left leaning (way left, apparently) writers to say they don’t support the US.

    That’s fine if THEY don’t, but don’t mess with Supes.

    “Truth, Justice and the American way” – that’s Superman. Period.

    • Truth, justice, and the American way didn’t come about until the 50′s. And even when it did come about, it was used as propaganda against communism. Superman is a world icon, he promotes an idea of hope, peace, and brotherhood. As I recall, those ideals aren’t strictly inherent to America.

      • Would you cite that please.

        Even if it didn’t come about until the 50′s it would still mean it’s been that way for 60 years.

        And, it doesn’t change the sloppy method the current writers chose to show their disdain of the US.

    • No…That’s a slogan.

      Superman is much more, both in the context of the DC universe AND as an iconic symbol in our real world.

      • I am curious if people in other countries outside the US would really care if Superman was American.

        Assuming 1) They have heard of him and 2) they even had an issue with him being an American in the first place.

        Seriously, this high-minded crap that Superman can’t be Superman unless he renounces his citizenship is just pure politics. Plain and simple. And it needs to stay out of comics.

        • Actually, the Superman “S-shield” (along with the character it represents) is one of the most recognized symbols in the world, as famous as the McDonald’s “Golden Arches” or the Coca-Cola “Wave”.

          Comics are not what they once were; the real world has invaded and settled in for the long haul. It’s not always right, BUT it is true.

          • Hmm.. funny – everyone of those are American and easily recognizable as BEING American.

            Yet, I don’t here them renouncing the US to make a lame political statement.

            • Yes, because they are American companies (or representative of such). However, they are not capable of consideration, of thought. Superman is.

              You say lame; I say brilliant.

              • That made no sense nor did it add weight to your argument.

                • It’s quite simple:

                  The “S-shield”, the “Arches”, and the “Wave” are just pictures (two of them are purely marketing tools; the third is often used as one). THEY cannot think or hold an opinion.

                  Superman is sentient; thus, he CAN (and, I think, SHOULD).

                  It didn’t have to add weight to my argument; it merely had to support it. It did.

                  • Ok, I see where the disconnect is…

                    Supeman is a COMIC. By writers. Who used his intellectual property to push their agenda.

                    You are arguing comic logic. I am arguing real life.

                    While Superman is NOT real, he is a real American icon.

                    • Don’t worry…there was no disconnect. I stated very clearly what I meant. The fact that those writers, illustrators, etc., wrote the words coming out of the character’s mouth only confirms their real-world validity to me (and MANY others). You’re right that he’s an American icon…who stands for humanity as a whole.

                      Thank you for allowing me to explain even further :)

                    • @ Archeon: Your argument still makes not one whit of sense.

                      If Nike or Coke had a problem with being identified as an American institution or symbol, whether it be due to affecting sales or image, the boards of directors would pull up their headquarters to the nearest welcoming country.

                      Corporations have been relocating for years if they perceive a country’s business climate is hostile to them. look at Haliburton :)

                    • Santa…

                      Again, I was talking about the symbols, not their corporate (or national) entities. The pictures do not think. Superman does (in the comic universe, of course).

                      Obviously, the corporations/nations can express their opinions and may (and DO) use those symbols to do so.

                      The point I’ve been trying to make is that a lot of people are upset and saying that Superman would never say what he did in issue #900. I’m merely saying that MY read (as well as a lot of others’) is that he, in fact, WOULD (and, according to many of those people, SHOULD) say what he did…that his statement remains true to the essence of his character as it is and has been for quite a while.

                      I was not politicizing or claiming he NEEDED to renounce his citizenship…I was agreeing with idea that he did not go against type by doing so.

                      Superman, in the comic world, can make that choice. The other three symbols (including his own shield) can NOT.

      • Agreed. And it’s not disdain, but perhaps to you it is. To me, the writers are saying that Superman should be for every government, but does not favor one government in particular over another. Just be cause he said that truth, justice, and the American way are too small, doesn’t mean that he won’t uphold the same ideals that he was raised to believe.

        Also, “truth, justice, and the American way,” were first used in the 1950′s television show.

        • I think you are not grasping the entirety of the story or you are unfamiliar of the hippie movement in the 60′s and some of the things they did back then in protests.

          The frame up there that shows the man giving the soldier a flower – that’s pure 60′s hippie. That is what the hippies we doing as part of their protests and the writers (either in their arrogance or just lack of creativity) chose to translate that to a modern foreign situation.

          These writers’ hubris is very apparent. They assume that the protests in that country are by people who are like minded to those that would protest here. They are not. And I can speak on that because I have been over seas several times in countries where we are not liked.

          This was a poor way to celebrate 900 issues.

          If they intended to say Superman is for the world, it could have been done in a much better way than to pout about American interests after doing a sit-in.

          I mean, really. It’s blatantly transparent and a misuse of an American icon.

    • Ditto. “Truth, Justice and the American way” – that’s Superman. Period.

      • Again…NO, that’s JUST a slogan.

        • Seeing as he grew up in Kansas with the Kent’s, and they were farmers i think he would feel very much that way.

          • …that the statement is just a slogan? Yes, I agree.

            • It was most definitely NOT “just a slogan” at the time it was created – it was the defining statement for the character.

              Vic

              • I disagree with you on that..it wasn’t a defining moment it was anti-communist propaganda..so it’s okay for him to be used as a symbol to push an agenda in the 50′s but not in 2011?

                • Actually its been used since 1938 in the comics so its as much a part of who is as the S Shield on his chest.

              • Vic…

                I agree that when it first came about, the words did mean something more than just a slogan. However, as both the character and the nation progressed and evolved (in many respects), the statement took on more of a cliche’ tone. Yes, they still both meant AND implied that the principles upon which the country was founded were important and worthwhile, but the country, itself, did not necessarily consistently stand up to those ideals as much as we all wished.

                You are very much correct that it was not a slogan. I just think that it has become one in the last couple of decades.

                That’s all I was saying…

                • Archaeon,

                  No worries. :)

                  Vic

                • I think the words still mean something today. Matter of fact i have the big constitution and declaration of independence hanging in my house. They look like how they were when they were wrote.

  22. It seems to me that Superman can do whatever he wants… I mean he’s Superman! He’s NOT really American so it’s kinda right. I don’t know. It hasn’t done any physical harm to me so I’m not gonna worry about it.

    Oh, and how dare you put this story under “movie news”!!! (I am kidding. lol)

    • Not “really” American??

      What, immigrants can’t become Americans now?

      • Well he wasn’t born in America, and is technically an illegal alien. I think lol.

        • LOL, YES!

      • That’s not what I meant. I just mean that I’m sure there was never any actual legal thing to give him citizenship anyway

        • How would you deport a spaceman lol?

  23. This one of the other two comments I posted in other threads. Don’t worry–I will NOT find and repost the third, as these two say the brunt of what I wish to express on the matter. I apologize to anyone who thinks this overkill, but I am a horribly slow typist :P

    The first part of what appears below is Goldilocks, from the most recent Open Discussion; I’m posting his comment because, unlike Nautius, a poster most people on this site see relatively often, I wasn’t sure if as many people would recognize Goldilocks. I simply wish to be fair to him by letting others be able to find our precise back-and-forth. If you do so, you will notice I have “calmed down” my response in this repost…I was a tad bit more heated (not against Goldilocks…just about the issue) and thought I should refine my…somewhat more zealous response.

    Here we go:

    Goldilocks 2 days ago
    That’s what I heard, also, either on this website, or Blastr, or possibly Comic Book Movie. Personally, political “correctness” or no, I think since Superman was originally written as an “American” hero, he should stay that way. And don’t anyone dare try to make Captain America into a Captain Global or anything like that, either (just sayin’!).

    Archaeon 2 days ago
    Captain America already gave up his identity once before, when he became Nomad because he was upset with the policies of the American government.

    As for Superman, in the modern world, he do much more good if his hands aren’t tied by political doctrine…He hasn’t given up on America, despite what so many [people say]. He, in fact, hopes (perhaps, idealistically) that he can PROTECT America by not having other governments believe that he is acting only to further American interests. That is certainly NOT political correctness; it is strategy.

  24. Why don´t you look at his eyes?

    • What does THAT mean?

      • I think he means to say, “Why don’t you look at it through his (Superman’s) eyes?”.

        • Oh.

          I thought I was…at least as I perceive he would see things.

          Thank you, Kahless.

          :)

  25. I’ve always considered Superman not to be an American citizen. He’s Kryptonian and therefore a Krypton, a heritage he proudly accepts and resides on Earth. Clark, on the other hand, is American. He grew up in America, raised in Kansas and is an American citizen due to being adopted by the Kents.

    I’m sure that doesn’t make a lot of sense but I have see Superman/Kal El as his true identity and Clark as his alter ego. For me they are two people with two separate identities and two separate citizenships. That’s why I do not understand the comic or the point. I get that others may see Superman as an American because that is where he lives. Perhaps I’m missing something (besides the whole American way which I wouldn’t be surprise if that was added in the 50s in response to the Cold War).

  26. Leftist fail. lol

    In a world that has many superheroes who have no national allegiances, it’s indefensible (as much as Ben tries here) to subvert age old values of the most iconic American hero.

    Everyone who has a stake in Superman must be wishing their stupid idea hadnt been floated. (no, the outrage doesnt translate into good publicity).

    What IS funny is watching liberals backpedal, gloss over, and “ham fisted”ly defend this bone head move.

    Tell ya what, why not just leave superman alone and let him do what he’s been doing for 80 years? If the left wants their own superhero just dress Alan Colmes up in a pink cape, call him ThooperDuperMan and let him do the morally righteous fight at the UN, denouncing US actions on a monthly basis.

    • You can be as childishly insulting as you wish…it doesn’t mean you’re ANY wiser than anyone else, on EITHER side of the discussion/debate/argument.

      • I cant imagine someone being slighted by my view unless the person IS of the opinion the US should capitulate to the backwards ideals of the UN. (Or maybe an Alan Colmes fan). lol

        • I felt no slight; i simply pointed out there are other opinions besides yours, and they are just as viable…and often, much more civilly stated.

          No worries :)

          • I had not directly insulted any poster here, or even called names.

            But here you come on your pony twice now, calling me immature and uncivil.

    • And all they are good for is passing resolutions.

  27. What’s uncivil is directly attacking and name calling another poster because you dont agree with his or her opinion.

    • I did not call you any names; I also did not say you were right OR wrong. I merely commented on your verbal behavior regarding an entire group of people (“Leftist fail”, “wishing their stupid idea hadn’t been floated”, “liberals…defend this bone head move”, “ThooperDuperMan”).

      Ummm, WHO was name-calling and attacking based on a mere difference of opinion?

      Try harder…or don’t. :)

      • I didnt direct it at a poster here. You on the other hand have.

        Good day.

        • …directed what? A response to an insulting post? Yes. Yes, I did.

          Good day to you, sir. :)

        • A bully is a bully whether they are attacking a single person or a group of people that are there or not.

          • Now it’s bullying when someone speaks their opinion of an actual ACT which they disagree. Poor victims of disagreement, lol.

            Archaeon, yes you specifically were talking to me, and used the words uncivil and immature. I didnt point at a single person here in my post.

            Argue as much as you like about it, I mean it’s all here to see. Would you like to argue what air is next?

            • No…Protesting the act if you disagree is very appropriate, wholly American. What’s not, and IS bullying, is insulting the people who hold the opposite view, as opposed to those opinions, themselves…implying they’re failures or stupid because they have a different perception than you.

              Reread your initial post…THAT is bullying (or, at very minimum, insulting).

              • Oh, and yes, I was specifically talking to you. I certainly didn’t think Screenrant or its general population of posters was being insulting…just you.

                • Epic fail, try again.

                  • Nope. Already succeeded. Thank you for play. Buh-bye.

                    :D

                    • …playING, that is…

                      ;)

                  • OK, that’s enough – I’ve had it with you two. Netshark, your opening “volley” did have some flame-bait about it with your “Leftist fail” opening. And no I’m not attacking you because I’m not on that side politically.

                    So let’s all just drop this, shall we?

                    Vic

                    • Adios.

                    • The poster should have stated his/her opinion of the topic, not his/her opinion of me.

                    • I apologize, Vic.

                      Thank you for your patience.

  28. “Comic books creators just need to stop shoehorning real events into their comic books in an effort to make them more “important” like the “real world.””

    I agree 100% with this.

    What comic book creators need to do is not write about real life – leave that to the journalists – but write _around_ them. These events happened and it’s undeniably hard to avoid them completely in a comic that claims to be a reflection of real life, but don’t _write_ them into being the central plot of a story. It’s insulting to the people who actually witnessed (and were victimized) by these events to get a “fictional” take on what happened.

    Do it like Stan Lee did back in the old days – he had his superheroes go on adventures into communist nations, sure, but he never actually had Iron Man take part in the Vietnam War other than being an unfortunate victim of an attack. He wrote about Sgt. Fury and Captain America fighting in WWII but that was a battle already in the past. And as far as culture, he did have characters like Thor harshly comment about the inactivity of the hippies and such – but never actually go to Woodstock. Either way, it worked. These early Marvel stories were still informative and evocative and thoughtful without having to include the actual events themselves.

  29. This is what happens when you can’t find the Open Discussion link: Obama bin Laden is dead =P

    • Yeah, some of American’s supermen (Delta Force no doubt) finally took him out.