5 Reasons Why ‘Superman vs. Batman’ Can Be the Next Big DC Superhero Movie

Published 1 year ago by , Updated April 15th, 2014 at 11:23 am, This is a list post.

Batman Superman Movie Discussion Fight Villains Story We've been running this series of articles for a few installments, but up until now, the potential DC superhero films we've discussed (Aquaman, Wonder Woman, Flash, Justice League) have been just that: potential films. As in, non-existent. However, DC and Warner Bros.' upcoming Batman vs. Superman sequel to Man of Steel is already a reality - only it's a reality that many (so-called) fans have been quite skeptical about, thus far. So, while we can't discuss why the teaming of the 'World's Finest' would be a success if they made it into a movie, we can discuss why the movie will be a success if they do it right. READ our 5 Reasons that Batman vs. Superman CAN be the next big DC superhero movie...

The Story

Superman Batman movie Story - Lex Luthor and  Bruce Wayne Man of Steel left us with a Superman who debuted to the world via a city-collapsing battle that left many dead. Anyone who knows The Dark Knight - the one who exists in a super-powered Justice League universe - knows that he is not okay with idea of a god-like alien running around unchecked, beholden to no one. That's a great foundation for a Superman/Batman story. Imagine: After the "Battle of Metropolis" Lex Luthor emerges as a hardline anti-Superman political figure, who rebuilds Metropolis with the help of fellow industrialist Bruce Wayne. Meanwhile, the two brilliant businessmen discover a "deterrent" to the Superman problem in the form of Kryptonite. Bruce/Batman starts off going against Superman and humbles the Man of Steel by using Kryptonite to beat him; Lex is eventually revealed as a villain (with a Metallo henchman?); the two heroes must work together (brains AND brawn) to stop him; and in the end, Supes and Bats establish a mutual level of respect and trust to bond them... We're just spit-balling here, but you see how this could all easily work, right?    

The Characters

Batman Superman Movie - Clark Kent, Lois Lane, Bruce Wayne The best tactic in a good "buddy-cop" story  - especially superhero buddy-cop stories - is having characters who are proper foils for one another (i.e., balance one another out). Batman and Superman are more than characters - they are almost yin and yang archetypes that serve as metaphors for just about any conflicting philosophies you can think of (idealism vs. cynicism, brains vs. brawn, etc.). It's the same reason that Batman vs. The Joker or Superman vs. Lex Luthor tend to be the best rivalries: dynamic contrast. And, in the case of Batman and Superman, there are great rivalry AND friendship dynamics at work between these two titans of heroism. It's not just the Superman/Batman dynamic that is golden: Bruce Wayne and Clark Kent work great together, as well. Bruce can literally buy and own The Daily Planet, while Clark (as an investigative reporter) can easily infiltrate the seedy underworld where Batman gets his hands dirty. The opportunities for farmboy vs. billionaire banter are limitless (both before and after alter-egos are exposed) and when you throw Lois Lane in the middle, you have the cherry to top it all off.

The Fight

Batman Superman Movie Fight Scenes This is the big thing that has people talking and arguing all over the Interwebs:  How can Batman POSSIBLY stand up to Superman in battle? In case you don't know: Batman has won several decisive victories over Superman in comic book canon. In fact, a Batman victory speech from the comics was the very thing quoted during the Batman/Superman movie announcement at SDCC '13. "But how does Batman, a mere human, win against Superman, a god?" you may still be asking. The answer is simple: Batman always has a plan. Superman (as Batman often likes to point out) throws brute force at every problem and is too comfortable with his own imperviousness. Bruce Wayne and/or Lex Luthor are prime characters to expose those hubrises, either via Kryptonite or a public stance against Superman's threat to the world as a living WMD. Indeed, the next stage in the Man of Steel's development may be the humility of discovering that he is both accountable to and vulnerable to mankind's wrath. We look forward to The Dark Knight pulling off some epic battle plan to take Superman apart piece-by-piece, in the way that only Batman can.

The Iconography

Batman Superman New 52_by_lazerbat-d63ut0l As we keep stressing: this pairing of icons is not oil and water, it's oil and vinegar. Batman and Superman are better defined as individuals when juxtaposed to one another - and in that comparison they also form the two polar ends of the DC superhero spectrum. Batman and Superman on screen together is more than just a movie - it's a milestone. Whether you are the geek who dreamed about, discussed and debated this event for years on end, or the casual observer who has found him/herself oddly perplexed by the question of which hero best represents your personality (Batman or Superman), this team-up is so iconic and riddled with symbolic depth that the movie will practically sell itself. ...And if Tony Stark and Nick Fury's meeting was epic enough to galvanize an Avengers universe, there's little doubt that the sheer iconography of having Superman and Batman in the same frame of film will be enough to give birth to an entire Justice League universe. (Artwork by Jim Lee w/ inks & colors by Swave18 & LazerBat)

Continuity

Justice League New 52 Movie Do we really need to say it again? Batman and Superman form the polar ends of the DC superhero universe, leaving an open door for future characters to fill in the middle. And with Batman vs. Superman allegedly building right on top of the events of Man of Steel, a Justice League universe continuity is officially being established. By the time Batman vs. Superman is done, the mutual respect between The World's Finest can act as the solid foundation upon which a Justice League team is built. Superman can be a little bit more vulnerable and more of the responsible boy scout that fans love, while Batman can be reintroduced to the world as a tactical genius badass who is able to stand alongside the most powerful being in the world, while also becoming more open-minded to the idea of friendship and partnership. Where the DC universe goes after that is still an open debate, but in terms of building continuity on top of Man of Steel, Batman vs. Superman is in a better position than most other DC superhero movies would be. (However, CLICK the following links to read our theories on why Aquaman, Wonder Woman and Flash movies could work just as well.)

Justice League Movie - Solo Character Films Below is a quick bullet list of our responses  to some of the more pronounced criticisms of Batman vs. Superman, which we addressed in greater detail within the article.
  • It's too soon to reboot Batman - Actually, we need a Batman who can exist in a superhuman reality. Nolan's version isn't really that.
  • Batman and Superman don't fit together - Actually the characters and their worlds fit together like PB&J. See HERE or HERE.
  • Batman couldn't last 2 seconds against Superman - If you read the comics, you'll see that Batman uses smart tactics to counter Superman's unlimited power.
  • It's too soon for this - Are you kidding? Some of us have been waiting DECADES for this happen!
_______ Batman vs. Superman will be in theaters sometime in 2015. All comic book artwork is the property of DC comics; Superman/Batman logo by  Balsavor @ DeviantART 
TAGS: batman, batman vs superman, man of steel, superman

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  1. Tho id like a fight, id prefer if the fight started or ended with a little psychological on batmams part. Bringing uo everything clark did wrong and reminding him that he is an alien from a planet that is destroyed. Then end with the final blow about his father dieing until he crumbles

  2. Good points. I was all in anyway but now I’m 100% in. I have faith it will be Epic. It will make a billion for sure with all the batman and superman fans together.

  3. You misattributed that DeviantArt picture: read its description and you’ll find out that only the colours were done by the artist you credited for it. Inks are by a different artist, on pencils by Jim Lee (whose signature is clearly visible in the picture; come on, guys, it wasn’t that hard).

    • We also attributed all artwork to DC comics, so I think we’re covered.

      • But there’s an updated link, just for you, Kenji.

        • I gather you thought I was being a smartass. I’m just bored out of my mind.

          Incidentally, neat article, although as you say within the article itself this isn’t really a matter of why it “can” be DC’s next big movie, but rather of why it “will” be so; unless they manage to produce really terrible trailers for this, driving fans away from theatres, I think it’s safe to assume this movie is bound to be “big”, if only in terms of cash inflow. And after this particular year, I guess it’s clear to everyone that the art of producing terrific trailers for decent movies has been nailed down to a science.

  4. While i agree with Batman always having a plan. I would like to see Bats getting his ass kicked around town in the beginning of the movie. As much as it would put a bad rap on Batman it would also be a good growing situation for him. P think this would help to show off his detective skills a little more than Nolan’s Trilogy did.

    I could also see them making room for maybe a few other smaller DC characters/heroes in this movie. If only just a ten second clip. I think it would be smart to help them to get people to believe that all these super powered beings coexist in the same universe.

    • Batman is going to be older, he will be more experienced so there is no need to establish a “growing situation” for him.

      • Agreed. Please don’t waste screen time with yet another version of Batman’s origin. We know who and why Batman is. If the producers just can’t stand not having something in the flick about that…a line or two of dialogue can handle it. Get on with the story. This point is a good reason to go with Ryan Reynolds as Green Lantern…if GL is in the story. His origin is already established. That that movie flopped is irrelevant.

    • Agreed. I think Batman should get his butt kicked at some point in the film. I’d hate to watch it aha but it’d be cool for Batman to have an epiphany of some sort on the matter.

  5. Must be a slow news day to post this story on Young Alien vs Old Predator.

    This movie is a horrible idea from the word go. Nobody wants to watch an old Batman fight an young Superman, even DC fans. I know Warner Brothers-DC is desparate, especially with Marvel’s dominance, but this isn’t the way to go. Bring in a young Batman, and team him with this young, but awful Superman, and try to build some kind of shared universe to form the Justice League, if they can. Whatever they do, just try to make a better movie that Man of Steel, that was embarassing.

    Warner Brother-DC and this movie have no “S”.

    • Sure thing, Ron.

    • Everyone wants to see batman vs superman age doesnt mean anyrhing. An older batman offors the exciting possibility of a batmam beyond movie. Which would be an inventive and interestimg thimg that we havnt seen on screen

      • Sorry for the misstypes, my phone is awful once the battery gets low

      • That’s actually the plan by WB to make a Batman Beyond story during the Justice League movie where Terry McGinnis takes over as Batman for the reason why they are introducing an older already established Batman that will retire after the confrontation with Superman.

        • I really dont get peoples insistance on introducing batman beyond into this equation. The show was fine, but unremarkable, Ive no idea how the comics did, but then, I never cared.

        • Noooooo only Bruce can be batman

    • Speak for yourself Ron. I think EVERYONE, except you, wants to see this happen.

      • @Glenn +1

    • @Ron
      *rolls eyes*

      @Trey
      Do you think they’ll be doing a Batman Beyond movie in the future? I think it’d be a great idea and would open the doors to timeline storylines that are usually seen in the comics. I just wouldn’t want it to succumbed by the time travel aspect. I say do it similar to how Looper did it, have it as a plot point that starts off the storyline.

      • I can only see it working if it involves a traditional Batman villain coming back to haunt Bruce in the future.

        Joker is the easy way out, but you can do others like Mr. Freeze, Clayface, Ra’s Al Ghul, or even Hush.

        • Rian johnson would be my pick to do a batman beyond mpvie for sure. And i feel its very possible if you can find the right unkown actor for terry. Like ACW said the rogue gallery for batman beyond isnt that exciting. I thinkbatman beyond wpuld br a great way to introduce villains that we havnt seen on screen. People like hush, deathstroke snd maybe even a lossly based under the red hood adaptation that involves the red hood being one of bruces old aquentances. I believe batman beyond is a fantastic idea but only with the right actor and director. It would be an interesting way to have the old justice league batman play both bruce waynes in both films. As the stories then collide with the reveal in a justice league film as to why bruce retired and is alone.

          • It’d be cool to see the villain in the future first, than appear in a movie taking place in the present right after. Agreed with Rian Johnson, he can definitely do the sci fi aspect of the film. While I agree with casting an unknown actor as well, I think it’d be cool to see Joseph Gordon Levitt as Terry, he may be a bit old but both Johnson and Levitt work very well together and I can see them establishing such a franchise.

            • I could accept JGL since he works so well with johnson. I believe they could just make terry in college.

        • I like the idea of Hush returning or Ra’s Al Ghul, I may put a Batman Beyond villain in the mix as well. Maybe the radioactive guy there, I forgot his name.

          • I say Hush because there was an arc in the Beyond comic that involved Hush returning.

            • Really? I haven’t read the comics so I wouldn’t know but I definitely gotta check that out.

            • @ACW

              Why not Hush? Mr.Elliot one of the few villains that can match The Dark Knight in both Intellect and skill.

              Batman always did have a problem when He was the intended target directly.

    • I don’t know if old is the right word, but it needs to be an established Batman. One who doesn’t really have any more learning curves. He doesn’t need to be in his 60′s, he just needs to be old enough to know what being Batman is all about.

      • Exactly. He could be that at 30. If he started at 25 he would already have a 5 years experience behind him.

  6. I am pumped for this movie. However, would rather see a team-up beetwen Flash (Barry Allen) and Green Lantern (Hal Jordan), or Doctor Fate (Kent Nelson) and Hourman (Rex Tyler). I also would not mind a three-fer: The Atom, Hawkman, and Martian Manhunter.
    Batman could not defeat Superman, even with Kryptonite. Supes could just fry him with heat vision from a distance, or blow him out to sea with his super-breath (Hey Aquaman, throw me a towel and a life-preserver!), or race up to him at super-speed and slam him into atoms and race away again before the Kryptonite could take effect. Green Lantern, likewise, could possibly beat Supes if GL formed, say, a Kryptonite cage around him, before Supes could fly up to him at super-speed and box his lanterns off. But GL would have to work fast and get the first zap in.

    • I think the fact that he is so young and inexperienced as a hero will even the playing field a little. Superman would never heat vision batman he doesnt want to kill him, i think the killing of zod with result in him being more of the boy scout. Nor batman or superman want to kill each other they just want to incapacitate. Which i feel a batman with kryptonite has the biggest advantage.

    • Batman is sneaky, he will have a lead lined utility belt and expose the kryptonite after getting close enough to Supes.

      Once he exposes the rock, supes will be at his mercy, or at the very least, unable to “speed” away to reduce the effects…therefore UFC DC.

    • Your scenarios presupposes Superman would have no problem with the idea of killing Batman. He killed Zod because because he saw no alternative. They were equal in power and Zod had no qualms about killing as many humans as possible. Right then, right there…what else could he do? Killing Batman…should not be necessary in any situation.

      • Speaking hypothetically, not in the scope of a movie or comic or their personality natures, just a good old anything goes street-fight, winner take all, only one walks away.

  7. I’m still hoping older means a 34 to 35 year old Batman. I’m pretty sure he won’t be 45 to 60 years old. Since Superman is 33 i don’t think Batman should be 22.

  8. I still don’t like Snyder and Goyer being behind it.

    • +1, couldn’t agree more. I’ve waited years for Superman and Batman to appear on-screen together, I just can’t believe that when it finally comes around the responsibility has been given to Zack Snyder, and even worse Goyer to write it.

      Why?????? Man of Steel had so many problems, the Script, story, screenplay and pacing where an absolute disaster.

      An hour and half of flashbacks and then a solid hour of buildings exploding, that was basically the entire movie.

      {The fact that they have to already shoe-horn Batman into the sequel is perfect proof that the movie was a let down and not well received)

      Warner Brothers, in your panicked attempt to keep up with Marvel, I’m afraid you’re gonna mess this amazing opportunity up. In fact, you guys already have, with the disaster that was Man of Steel.

      • MoS was pretty good. You’re cherry picking. It was better than IM3, but not as good as The Wolverine. I’m not sure what other direction they could have gone in a fight between Zod and SM without widespread destruction.

    • Goyer- substitute (he’s a fail)
      Snyder- keep (he’s a bloody genius)

  9. You don’t need 5 reasons, you just need one:

    Because it’s Batman.

    Peace! I’m out!

    • +1

  10. Id like to see Batman in his prime, not late 30′s early 40′s & WB hasn’t gave a good enough list of candidates imo. I agree WB/DC is desperate to catch up to Marvel but rushing things causes more bad than good. I hope they use different kind of Kryptonite other than Green K that gets discovered & tested on Superman while the Green K might get found by film’s end.

    • Really though… Do you have to bring it up all the time?

    • I doubt that i think they ha been thinking about it for awhile. I think Superman and Batman on screen together is enough to make over $1 Billion.

  11. Umm, can we petition the writer of this article to write the screenplay? Seriously though, awesome article. Well well written. Agree with all your points. I was very skeptical when first hearing about this idea. I think standalone films, with maybe cameos would be the way to go. But after reading this, I can see, with the right gameplan and mastermind ala Whedon or Nolan or someone on that level, it may work.

    Just one thought though, one or both heroes will no doubt look like the “bad guy” in a fight like this, whether they are influenced by pride, ego, fear, whatever, having two iconic characters fight will give the movie audience unease I think. yes, they have squared off many times in comics, but the movie audience, the casual viewers, may be confused.

    So I say, lets introduce the Red kryptonite first, maybe even a little Scarecrow fear poison for good measure (maybe thats overdoing it), and lets give a good reason why the initial fight happens. Then when the Red wears off, we have established distrust between them and therefore their opposing views are digestible, until the Green kryptonit is introduced…then we got ourselves a movie! yes to the rest, Luthor/Wayne enterprises rebuild Metropolis, then Luthor starts to dabble in Gotham affairs, whihc finally makes Bruce question his motives and Bats and Supes put aside their differences to serve the greater good and voila!

    Ok Im no screenwriter but i liked your ideas!

    • The suggested scenario is a good one. Problem is…now that it has been suggested here…they can’t use it! Gotta come up with something no one else has thought of.

    • nah wait and introduce red kryptonite in the Justice League movie!

  12. This is one of the few occasions were the phrase “Because it’s Batman and Superman” applies.

    Before major theatrical films in the 21st century, DC was doing an amazing job with the birth of the DCAU. BTAS was up for Emmy nominations and actually won a couple if I’m not mistaken. Warner Bros. ruled the planet with that along with shows like Animaniacs and Freakazoid, they got the attention of a lot of people because they were REALLY good.

    They developed a following beforehand, which is always nice. Even the Adam West Batman got the attention of a lot of people because it was the perfect Batman of that time. The live action Spider-Man show didn’t really catch up with it by the time it launched.

    To me, that’s where I’ve always felt DC has had the upper hand on Marvel when it comes to this fanboy war nonsense. Take away the theatrical films and DC still has more recognized characters they took the time out to build upon in other forms of entertainment.

    • Very well said sir!

    • All of my yes to you, sir!

    • All true but great results in the past are never a guarantee for the future, Unfortunatly for DC , Marvel is more succesfull even movies like IM3 are so far not changing that.
      But i believe in DC’s potential. :)

      Im not a fanboy of any of them. Just a movie lover in general,
      As a kid i enjoyed cartoons of both DC and Marvel

  13. Yeah dude you’re out of your mind and don’t speak for everyone. I’m pretty sure most people would like to see batman and superman do just about anything. This is a movie concept that people have been excited about for as long as I can remember. I see zero reason that would be any different now. The movie will be huge regardless

  14. Actually, in canon, Batman and Supes have almost 10 times and as far I know, Batman has never won any of those fights. Also the concept of someone humbling the Man of Steel is somewhat ludicrous,seeing how he considers himself no better than anyone else( plus I feel like that would shoot the whole “Superman is the Ideal/hope people should be striving towards” theme in the foot). Personally I dont want either of them to win but instead for the fight to end in a draw with both of them giving the other a good thrashing while learning something new character-wise about the other.

    • While it makes for an interesting concept, Superman would never lose to Batman ever. All he has to do is zap him with heat vision from a mile away, or use superspeed to get behind him and deliver a knockout punch, or fly above him and drop an anvil on his head, or use super breath to create a tornado that sweeps Batman away, or any of a million other ways that no human would stand a chance no matter how crafty they are. Any scenario in which Batman wins requires Superman to be really stupid and predictable and not even try.

      See this: http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/3/34678/1068705-winner.gif

    • That is true. Article writer is wrong. He thinks that if it happened in comics it means that all comics are canon which is obvious b*******.
      And if Snyder is smart he will make it a draw, some fight like in Hush where both looked good and everything was explained. But unfortunately he is talking to Miller so expect downgraded Superman(at least stupid but maybe not government dog, there is still hope) and Batman as almost clear winner.

  15. I disagree with four of the five points.

    THE STORY – Batman is GOING to take up a lot of screen time seeing as how he is the “real” star of the movie. That leaves little time for the villain Lex Luthor (or a henchman) to be established. As we know from the Dark Knight, Spider man (2002) or Thor, a compelling villain can make a film OR a not very compelling villain can damage a film (Iron Man 2).

    THE CHARACTERS – Nobody knows THIS Batman. To establish that chemistry between the two heroes takes time to develop. I can hear someone about to write “but everyone knows Batman!” That is flat out wrong! The Keaton Batman is different from Kilmer, which is different from Clooney which is different from Bale. Add to that many critics of the Man of Steel (even the ones who enjoyed the movie like myself) who feel as though they never really got a chance to know THIS Superman in his role as a hero. So how can the dynamics of two characters you are not that familiar with play out effectively? Sure the movie could spend a significant amount of time delving into that but then you run into the problem of under developing your REAL villain. The movie is only two (maybe three) hours long. And I have not even gotten to ancillary characters Lois Lane and Perry White. I assume they cast Oscar nominated actors and actresses in the role because they were significant to the story. then you would need to spend time with the “fight” and supposed team-up.

    THE FIGHT – This is an assumption that I think comic fans are mistaken about. If a Batman/Superman fight is central to the story, I think it turns many people off. A lot of people like both heroes. They are really not that interested in seeing them square off. I don’t believe the average person is looking forward to that at all. On top of that, Superman fans will be turned off if Batman “wins” (especially in what is supposed to be Superman’s own movie) and vice versa. In the Avengers for example the fights between the heroes were not central to the story nor was there ever a “winner”. The team-up and working together was the payoff. So depending on how focal the Batman/superman conflict is I think it could backfire.

    CONTINUITY – There is NONE! The audience knows next to nothing about anyone other than Superman (outside of previous comics and films). If as has been reported that an “older” person that is possibly a retired Batman is what will be used for movie then everything about his younger crime fighting life is a mystery that can never be addressed. How did he defeat the Joker when they encountered each other…who knows? What about “Robin” was there ever one? Who knows? That to me makes it a hard sell for people to connect to this Batman. Just because they know the basics of his origins, they still would not have a sense of how he thinks, fights, or addresses crime without having to consider unrelated written and film material.

    • I think people have to understand that it’s a movie. There’s quite a lot of material you can fit in it that can maybe intertwine into one storyline, which benefits character development, getting to know and love a character and moving the story along to bigger things in the future. It isn’t an episode of a TV show. One of the challenges of a movie in my opinion is covering a huge amount of material in about 2 or 3 hours long. It can be done.

      I didn’t watch any Marvel movies before The Avengers apart from Iron Man and I ended up loving the movie because the performances and actions of the characters sold me. It’s all about knowing and feeling their state of mind at the moment in the movie, not what they did in the last ten years of their existence. Same goes for X-Men, sure it’s one franchise but there’s still almost a dozen characters they introduced.

      Say if someone met me today, do they really need to know my entire history and background just to say they know me? Or like me?

      • awesome points

      • But regarding watching the Avengers…I am presuming you were familiar with the characters perhaps through the comics. How do you think you would have reacted to the Avengers if the movie was centered around a fight with let’s say Iron Man and Thor. I think it suddenly makes it a different kind of movie …kind of like making a movie about James Bond versus Jason Bourne.

        I believe Avengers worked because it was focused on how they get together not so much how different they are or how they view life or crime fighting. There is a clear distinction between who is good and bad. I also think wanting to see who “wins” fights between comic heroes (as opposed to villains) is more a comic book culture fetish than something the common movie goer wants to see. I would imagine that they are more interested in good overcoming evil. In fact I think that is why Watchmen did not connect with audiences because it muddles who the “good” guys are and who are the “bad” guys. Focusing on a Superman versus Batman movie goes down that same path.

        • Not really man, I heard of Thor but didn’t know anything about the character. Didn’t even know he was thunder god to be honest ><, I know, I'm a disgrace aha.

          • You should be flogged…just kidding! Well maybe you are the exception to the rule. If enough of you say the same thing I will have reverse my point!

            • Well I’ll be basing my opinion on the box office. Thor and Captain American made around 300 or 400 mil. And I know people would’ve probably bought the DVD or watch it on Netflix later on but The Avengers made 1.5 billion, that’s a huge gap. There no telling how many people didn’t see the solo films before The Avengers. I could be wrong though.

          • You didnt know the day Thursday came from Thor ? :) and friday comes from Freiya. … Germanic Pagan Gods from Pre Christianity… They teached me as a kid…

            I know nothing about Thor in the Marvel comics, but they stayed true to the mythology. Was easy to follow

            Grts ! :)

        • That’s the thing: you don’t know what this movie is going to be about, none of us do. You just assume that everything they’ve been saying is 100% how it’s going to be.

          Why does everyone suddenly think WB is brain dead? There is no confirmation that this whole movie is going to revolve around Superman and Batman beating the tar out of each other, “Superman vs. Batman” does not automatically = “Freddy vs. Jason” or “Alien vs. Predator” and we don’t even know if it is the real title.

          You map out all of this and mention the Michael Keaton Batman. That worked without having an entire hour revolving around how Bruce Wayne became Batman. And they could always venture into this new Batman more in another movie, I don’t think you grasp what makes Batman interesting: there is a lot of things people do not know about him because he is very secretive.

          • You are right we don’t know! But the presentation made by Snyder signals it centers around that conflict between the heroes as well as the quote that was read and the “initial” suggested title. All of this is speculation on my part and I understand it is fluid, but even if it is making these points at least informs some of the pitfalls they might encounter.

    • I think screenrant should do a ’5 reasons why Superman v Batman could be the biggest mistake since Batman and Robin and kill the DC universe for good’, for your sake Patrick :)

      • What they should do is an article about why it was a dumb idea to not incorporate their already successful DC franchise which would have put them in a position to compete with Marvel instead of being embarrassed by them time after time!

        • What is with that ” COMPETE WITH MARVEL” or “Gems Marvel has created”..as if Marvel has created Seven Samurai or Godfather or Starwars…. till this time marvel has made only 2 good movies(Ironman and Avengers) out of 7, all others were mediocre or poor.MOS will make 700 million by the end which is a very good start and they can easily come in league o Marvel with the next movie.

          • You’re one of the few people who thinks Thor, Capt. America, and The Incredible Hulk were poor….I like when dip sticks spout of their opinions as fact.

    • Patrick…I’ve been a radio talk show host. I mention that to give you some context…a College baseball coach told me something once that hit home and was very true, and I pass that along to you now. He told me…”you guys OVER ANALYZE EVERYTHING!” He was right. Just my opinion…I think you are over analyzing this thing. Relax. From what I understand about who is doing this…they have a pretty good track record. Let’s see what they come up with. I bet it’ll be pretty darn good. ;^)

      • Uhh …actually the people who are behind this DO NOT have a great track record. Warner Brothers has similarly gone in a different direction from the original director’s of super hero films twice before Tim Burton (Batman) and Richard Donner (Superman) and it resulted three of the worst superhero films of all time not to mention recent movies Catwoman (2006) and Green Lantern (2011). Zack Snyder’s LAST three films have gotten poor critical reception. I think if those things had NOT happened I would feel a bit better. But they did!

        • i bow to your awesomeness

        • Yup I wished Batman Forever would of been done more like the Tim Burton Batman movies. Everyone time i see it on i go why the lights all over the place. And a more realistic two face!

          • @ pawn65

            It almost did but Batman Returns was deemed too dark, not to mention McDonalds was stupid enough to sell toys related to the film in happy meals when they should know its a PG-13 film. Well all of them were but it caused WB to go into the “family-friendly direction” which Burton & Keaton didn’t like.

        • Green Lantern had some problems, I agree. But it was still a very good first attempt. Subsequent attempts, if they do them, should absolutely do better, just as in learning a new job but making a few mistakes should improve with training and guidence. Green Lantern did suffer from a weak script, yes, stupid humor, yes, needed to be more serious, yes…but all fixable for Green lantern #2, if done. One of the biggest problems it had was not the film but the “pile on” mentality that all the would-be critics had, that sunk it’s rep. This “bandwagon effect” is really not helpful to getting us good future movies. We are unlikely to get a GL #2 (although DC/Warner should definitely push ahead with one ASAP). We may or may not get a Flash flick now (although rumor has it DC/Warner, who retreated on this, is poking it’s nose slightly out of the woods with one, although I am not sure that introducing Flash on Arrow is the way to go versus a tentpole movie). And now we are back to Supes and Bats again. These could be successful, yes, but there is always a danger the studios are still vacilliating around and losing sight of their ultimate goal, a JLA movie, by just spinning in circles and trotting out tired old Supes and shopworn old Bats in various incarnations. MOS looks good, and I will buy the DVD, even though prior to that I have not liked any of the Bats or Supes flicks. MOS might be good, tho.

    • Patrick,

      We understand you and many others are disappointed that Nolan’s Batman will not be connected to the DCU.

      Please try to understand that Batman does not belong to Nolan. The character is timeless and can withstand interpretation after interpretation. Believe it or not, there is a healthy number of people who are Batman fans but not fans of Nolan’s Batman.

      As far as the general public is concerned… dude people know who Batman is. People are smart enough to discern that it’s something different. Even the one’s that aren’t, whatever… it’s not going to hurt sales either way.

      Count me as one who is thrilled this is finally happening, because the “who would win in a fight” Batman v Superman debate that has gone on since… let’s see here…ALWAYS… has been a favorite topic of debate of mine.

      • I agree with you (somehow) that Nolan does not own Batman. But let us look at the facts. The first Batman film of Nolan’s was NOT a runaway hit. So despite Batman legacy it was not automatically a huge hit which it sound like you are suggesting. In fact if it were a bad movie it might have led to another reboot. But still people had to get used to this version of Batman. Warner Brother’s was smart enough to build on that modest success and create the TWO billion dollar properties that followed. Would it not have been also smart to build on that success instead of going back to mediocrity whether or not Nolan was involved?

        • All you care about is Warner Bros. making a financial legend, that’s what I’m seeing.

          None of us work for WB so it is not really up to us to decide how they should make money. They have jobs specifically for that. So either it’s that or you can’t let Nolan go for some other reason.

          I could care less if they make less money than Marvel in a film, that’s not what makes a movie great.

          • Would you care if it derailed a future Justice League film?

            • If it doesn’t come, it doesn’t come. Just because Justice League does not find itself into the world of blockbuster movies does not make it inferior to Marvel.

              • But it has already been announced. If for some reason it did not happen it would look pretty bad for the studio. The ramifications for future Superhero films would be in a bit of trouble since WB owns ALL of the DC properties.

                • You are projecting a future that will not come to pass.

                  For Justice League to be derailed, Batman vs/and Superman would have to “bomb”.

                  I think your latest definition of “bomb” is either $700m or less than $1b.

                  There is no way a movie with both Superman and Batman in it makes less than $700m… in fact, I have ScreenRant bet you multiple times that it would make at least $1b.

                  Why? Because it’s Batman! (… AND Superman!)

                  • So IF the movie has bad reviews (as Man of Steel did) plus a possible summer where they are competing against the Avengers 2, Mission Impossible 5, Star Wars Episode 7, Assassin’s Creed, James Bond 24, Fantastic Four, Independence Day sequel, Pirates of the Caribbean 5, Hunger Games: Mockingjay, Pt. 2 and potentially Avatar 2 (but I am not sure if it is 2016)… not to mention children’s films Kung Fu Panda 3 and (the always formidable) Pixar’s Finding Dory…it will clear $700 million?

                    Consider that ONLY three films did so THIS year…and Man of Steel is so far not one of them.

                    I look forward to collecting on that bet!

                    • @Patrick:

                      So you are finally accepting? Took you long enough.

                      All those films are great (and not all will be in 2015 or in the summer)… but they all have one thing in common:

                      They don’t have Batman (and Superman).

                      It will clear $700m easily… save up your ScreenRant Dollars™!

                    • @BigNerd

                      It’s true that they don’t have Superman or Batman, but a couple of them are still going to make big money like Avengers 2, Bond 24, Star Wars Episode VII, and Avatar 2 (unfortunately).

                      Basically, in this economy, people are going to have to plan out their year wisely when it comes to movies.

                      I know the ones I am going to be seeing are (possibly) Avengers 2, Bond 24, Star Wars, and Superman/Batman. I’m also seeing Popeye and Assassin’s Creed, that might be it thought.

                    • @ BigNerd

                      OK

                      @ ACW 007

                      Popeye???

                    • @Patrick Bayard

                      Yeah, I grew up on classic cartoons and I’m interested in the new Popeye movie. It’s going to be fully animated. I don’t see any reason not to give it a chance because Popeye is a classic character and he’s not being brought into the real world like Alvin and the Chipmunks or The Smurfs.

                    • @ACW:

                      Don’t get me wrong, those films will make theirs too but just because they will, doesn’t mean Batman v Superman won’t.

                      If 2012 can have four $1bil films (8 over $700mil), I’m sure 2015 can too.

                    • @ ACW 007

                      I did not realize they were even making a Popeye movie. Thanks for the info!

                      @ BigNerd

                      You do realize that EVERY one of the eight movies (except one) that made over $700 million in 2012 were preceded by MORE than one previous tie in film.

                      The one that did not, The Amazing Spider-man, ranked 7th out of that list of eight. Just something to think about.

                    • @Patrick:

                      You do realize that you’re NOT strengthening your position? You claimed that because of the number of movies coming out in 2015 (many that do not have MORE than ONE previous tie-in film), that it would be hard for BvS to clear $700m.

                      But my example showed that a large number of films (tie ins or not) can all make over $700m so that’s not really a strong reason.

                      Then you proceed to tell me that 7 of those 8 had more than one tie-in film which doesn’t make it any stronger because

                      1. TASM was the first, and BvS will technically be a second (and as you’ve argued before, the second/third usually do better than the first).

                      2. The 9th film on that list is Hunger Games, no previous tie-in yet made $691m.

                      So if you think that a movie with both Batman and Superman in it, technically a sequel and going against films with not more than one previous tie-in (your stipulation) isn’t going to make more than a movie that had no previous tie-ins and not based on legendary icons… well… you’re delusional and reaching. But that’s fine, I’ll be counting my $SR all the way to the fake bank.

            • While I don’t think it would happen but imagine Batman and Superman bombs? Ugh I don’t even want to picture it. Going on to Rotten Tomatoes on release day and seeing 30% would bum me out to no extent.

              • EXACTLY what I would like to avoid. One of the reasons I lobby so much for the Nolan trilogy is that it built up good will from the movie going audience. After the great film that was Iron Man people were able to look past the bad film that was Iron Man 2. That and the good will built up from the Avengers pushed Iron Man 3 to huge success despite the fact that it also was not a particularly great film…in my opinion.

                If you start fresh with a new Batman the only good will that you have from any past “linked” film is Man of Steel which was a good movie (in my opinion) but for a lot of people was not. That to me is shaky ground to build from …but not terrible. So if the early reviews from a World’s Finest (or whatever it is called) are bad, then you are so right 30%..heck even 50% would REALLY concern me. I would start preparing for a world without a Justice League, Wonder Woman, or even Flash films. Pairing Bale and Cavill would feed off the popularity of the Nolan films the same way Iron Man 3 did from Iron Man and Avengers which would help it succeed even in the event the movie is not all that good.

                • Man of Steel was for sure split with everyone (one of my favourite superhero films nonetheless), the sequel will have to prove everyone wrong. If they don’t, DC movies are no longer in the game for another decade. Which would be a huge shame, one because it’s DC (Batman, Flash, Superman, Green Lantern…). Second, Zack Snyder seems like the guy who is really intent on making the universe the best it can be because of his love for the characters, which wouldn’t be nice to see go down the drain. Third, I really don’t want to see what happened to Routh’s career happen to Cavil’s. Routh practically fell off the face of the planet after Returns. They also have an amazing cast. And fourth, the set up Man of Steel established is simply fantastic in my opinion so it’d be a huge waste.

                  • I could not agree with you any more my friend! I liked Man of Steel a lot (so much so I saw it four times). But it just did not seem to resonate with everyone. As a person who leans towards DC based characters the good but not great reception makes me REALLY worried about the future.

                    • Oh thank God, I’m not the only one who loved MOS a lot. I thought it was going to become one of those movies where people did not dare to talk about.

                      Seriously, it made me a Superman fan.

                    • Damn! You beat me by one, saw it for the third time last night.

                      I find there’s one of two things that will happen. People will get over the fact that this is a different and updated Superman and take in the sequel for what it is. Or reject it once again for disliking the new Superman.

            • Superman batman r enough to compete with any one…Justice league not needed.Though if it comes…good

  16. I’d love to see this. But the problem is this.. Man of Steel is based more on the realism of “what if” an alien was living on Earth. And since they are going that way, how does a human, (as smart as Bruce Wayne is, and all the money he has), challenge a god like being? Say what you want, but the fact remains simply this. For Batman to beat Superman, would be like saying a single ant could beat a Great White Shark. It just can’t happen. Even in an interview when asked “who would win in a fight”, between Superman and Batman, Zak just chuckled and said, “Really?”. He even knows that Batman can’t win, no matter what the comics have done. Cause he’s not really going by the comics, he more into the whole “What if this was really going on?”. So maybe he has a plan and we are all defending our favorite hero over nothing..? But as much as I love Batman, there is no way a human could beat a god like being. Just as no human could beat Thor. And after talking to a bunch of Batman fan boys, they just seem to think that Batman could beat God himself. Whatever…

    • @Glen:

      Hehe… the “realism” of an alien living on Earth with god like powers can’t be challenged by a highly-trained, very tactical human with unlimited resources?

      Aliens with powers lose to normal humans all the time in the movies. David did beat Goliath. Giving in to “realism” doesn’t really make sense when you are talking about a comic book movie.

      Comic canon has Bats beating Supes more than once, so why not in a movie?

      • bats has beaten supes in comics, but not in canon

  17. I am so exited for this movie!!!! This is the movie I’ve been wanting for a while now. It’s the perfect way to introduce the new Batman, and I’ve always loved the dynamic between these two titans. Hehe, my favorite line from the animated movie Public Enemies is when Superman says, “That…was my best friend.”

  18. “5 Reasons Why ‘Superman vs. Batman’ Can Be the Next Big DC Superhero Movie”
    Nah, you only need one reason: BECAUSE IT’S BATMAN AND SUPERMAN IN THE SAME MOVIE!

    • Dang, should have read the comments first! You (kinda) beat me to the punch BigNerd! ;)

  19. i don’t want kryptonite to be a part of this universe just yet, i’d rather they take on the effects of red sunlight on a kryptonian, this would be perfect because they haven’t explored this in any movie yet and it doesn’t incapacitate supes like kryptonite does, it just depowers him

    • @ Mr. Clean

      I agree about Kryptonite part. Especially Green K. I prefer Blue K being used first atleast with Green K being found later by Lexcorp by the film’s end or further down.

  20. I think that this can be great, potentially. I just read TDK Returns for the first time, which only increased my interest (I know this film won’t be that story, but the basic dynamics…)

    However, I think that the assertion that Batman and Superman occupy “the polar ends of the superhero spectrum” while it may be true in the sense of personalities and strengths/weaknesses…does not really work in the sense of “setting up the universe so that everyone else can fit in between.” Superman has been set up as clear “first contact” science fiction, which is not as much a stretch beyond Batman as several of the other potential JL members. It is still not clear how some of the more mythologically-based characters (Wonder Woman especially) will exist in this universe.

  21. Because he is Batman and Superman…….there wont need any other RESON.

  22. I don’t know why they want to make Batman older than Superman. They can be the same age but Bats could have been at it since he was 24-25 yrs. But Gordon and the GCPD were downplaying him and his actions to avoid being embarsed. that way Batman has more experience but he and Supes are the same age.

    • Precisely.

    • If Superman is 33-35 and Bruce is 38-43 does it really matter? I think Cavill is like 36 or so and Bale is around 40…..actors don’t age like normal humans.

  23. I love this article. The fact that it had to be written speaks volumes & highlights issues that give me any number of concerns. 1) This MoS Superman stunk. He was so tween-emo-angsty teenage girl, he makes the sum of all Batman incarnations look Glee-happy in comparison. Superman is supposed to be the Light to Batman’s Dark. How are they going to adjust that? I don’t want to watch 2 hours of grumpy-poutfest. #2- the DC/WB track record for making these movies the way they “should be” is a HUGE issue. If they made this next film based on the 5 reasons, I’d have total faith & I’d be excited. But they have yet to prove they can consistently make films or choose writers/directors who understand the comics & characters and articulate them in a coheret story. Yes, they hit them out of the ballpark with TDK & TDKR, but Batman Begins was meh. They produced nonsense like The Green Lantern, they gave Superman a son in the first go, then doubled-down by having him not only kill someone with his bare hands (to save 4 people) but be responsible for damage so visually bad, there’s no way thousands of people didn’t die, which then makes his killing of Zod to save 4 people ridiculous. They then felt the need to saddle him with Lois right out the gate and there was zero chemistry between the 2 actors to compensate for their 15 minutes-turned love affair. DC/WB are trying too hard to be bigger/better/unique and as a result, they’re just churning out forced garbage that they have to re-boot. I am a Superman fan first and foremost, but the movies aren’t doing him any justice(no pun intended), nor will they until The 5 Reasons becomes a working reality for those responsible for making the films.

    • You are a real stupid ..Superman killed Zod to save 7 billion peoples not 4 peoples.Do u think that after killing those 4 peoples zod would have stopped …No he would have gone urther to kill millions then billions.There was no prison that can stop him, no phantom projector to send him away so killing him was only option.

      • +1…..I’d love for people to give a logical way of avoiding thousands of deaths in that scenario as well? If Superman says something along the lines of “we can’t fight here” does anyone think Zod would just go along with that?

    • I hope that WB/DC realizes there are A LOT of people that have your views. They need to either invest in focus groups or get a better handle of what people in general are thinking.

  24. I am all in, just wished you didn’t use the art work for the new 52, every character looks like a model for A&F.

    • You don’t like the New 52 designs? I think it’s a great departure from the traditional attires because they don’t look dramatically different.

      • @ ACW 007

        Im not big on the New 52 designs neither. All the best comics were done in the heroes traditional costumes.

      • I love the New 52 designs. I find it’s a great mesh of the old designs and the new armored looks.

  25. Id like to see Batman as young he was in Batman:TAS in his prime. Keeping low connections with Gordon while the mayor doesn’t know aswell most of Gotham’s police force.

    One thing about that series was how the Bat-signal debuted as Batman warned Gordon that the mayor may not approve if he saw it shining in the sky. Gordon replies back to him by letting himself worry about it.

  26. Really? Fight over Lois? Bad enough that some critics are calling MOS the new Twilight.

  27. warners did not have a plan going into MOS and it showed when they were
    not sure of the movie but not having any scene or post credits building up
    to next movie for 2014. so no surprise here because they need to be reassured of a guaranteed hit to justify taking any further risks. the only thing i dont want to see in this movie is 30 to 40 minutes being wasted in
    telling us batmans origin again.

    • Like I’ve said before:

      “Batman: Gotham Knight” supplied a very simple way to familiarize people with Batman without giving too much away: Bruce is sitting alone in the dark at Wayne Manor, staring into blackness, lost in a sea of thought. As we pan across his face, flashbacks of the night his parents died appear on screen. His face sits in a stone stature, almost as if this continues to haunt him (because it does).

    • just because marvel does post credit scenes doesn’t mean others have to as well

      • I agree. I say integrate plans for future characters in the actual story or give hints or something. Post-credit scenes, while they work well, isn’t the only method.

      • + 1000000000

  28. There’s a small part of Supes that envies Batman, batman can cross a line that supes doesn’t, but he secretly wants to.

    Once (in superman comics) Clark was having trouble sleeping, turns out he was running around the city as a masked vigilante called Guardian. Beating the heck out of criminals and doing things he’d never do as Superman. He never knew it, he thought he was sleeping but his subconscience mind created another personality to expend the rage and resentment building inside old supes.

    just saying… I think this fight will go both ways until they team-up for the finale against Luthor/Metallo.

  29. This list is 4 items too long. It will be a mega hit because both Batman & Superman are in it.