What Did You Think Of Star Trek? (Spoiler Discussion)
May 8, 2009 by Vic HoltremanNeed a place to talk about the Star Trek movie, including spoilers? Come on in…
Regular Screen Rant reader “790″ suggested I set up a discussion post for the Star Trek movie, where people can feel free to talk about all aspects of the film without having to worry about spoiling it for others. I had meant to set one of these up for Wolverine but just never got around to it.
Considering how popular I think Star Trek will be (moreso than Wolvie), I thought it might be a good idea to get this set up ASAP. 
So discuss the film below to your heart’s content!
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@Paul Young, Ken J and everyone else
Just checked back in. Thanks to Paul and Ken J for replying… I do appreciate the movies, both the originals and this one. Thanks, but I didn’t mean it in such a literal sense. I was just thinking, that if everything that takes place in this movie alters the future, then the events in the original movies would not probably unfold as such (think like in Back to the Future). Like in Star Trek IV – in the beginningspock’s Mother was there – she can’t now cuz she’s dead. Or in Trek II where Kirk says to Kristey Alley he was the only cadet to ever pass the simulation and even got an award for it. But in the movie, he gets a courtmarshall for it.
I would have no problem thinking of the movie as a reboot (like Batman Begins), a new origin story and all. But the problem is that its not. So does this mean that the Spock from the original timeline will cease to exist cuz he gets stuck in this alternate one?
I liked the movie, the acting was great and I really felt the emotions, especially when Kirk’s father saved the ship and died. And I know they gota revitalize the franchise but if all they were after was money, why not another TNG movie or DS9 or Voyager? I really think Voyager is long overdue for a movie.
I know there was a part that Spcok was explaining something about Nero not knowing what will unfold, and an alternate timeline and all. I kinda missed that cuz a friend was talking to me. So I will go watch it again. It’s a cool movie. It just escapes me as how its not a total complete re-imagining but its not a fully free prequel either. Choosing one of those paths would have been good (preferable the linear prequel). But when I think about it, its like this movie is stuck in the purgatory middle. So does this mean that they will remake all of the other Trek movies? Or just make more movies and alter history?
Andrew wrote:
“So does this mean that the Spock from the original timeline will cease to exist cuz he gets stuck in this alternate one?”
Actually, yes, it does mean that, but only after the point in which he crosses over into the black hole. Same can be said about Nero, he stops existing in the universe of the original timeline/continuity when he gets pulled into the black hole.
BTW, the first ever interracial kiss on tv was on Star Trek the original series. It was between Uhura and Kirk. Something I learned in my Sociology class. Pretty cool fact.
Now if they had not said that another timeline has formed, which means it’s within the same timeline/universe, then the events of this movie will alter the events that lead to these events in the first place, causing an endless loophole/paradox that will never sort it out. Grandfather paradox in essence. The theory that the instant something changes, that timeline splits apart from the original will prevent this from happening. So again, it all depends on which theory you subscribe to.
Correction “never sort itself out”
Cool… well again I find that it was a good movie and all. I’m not angry, more a bit confused and somewhat hurt. Confused cuz the writers (it was a very original and good script), could have done a better job of giving a bit more solid guidance to the script. And hurt cuz I’m a fan, and the idea of overwriting what had happened. Its not something I like…
Having a linear prequel would have been best I think. It would satisfy the fans and be able to introduce it to new fans. It’s for this reason that I don’t really read comics – too many retcons and all, makes it hard to follow. And for that reason I’d be hurt if that happened to Star Trek.
I read somewhere recently That Nichelle Nichols ,
The original Uhura felt that there ALWAYS was a strong attraction Between Uhura and Spock.
There must have been something in the writing to give her that impression.
@Andrew
Yah, typically in movies time travel is done within the same timeline in a linear fashion. Back to the Future’s, Terminator (although this could be argued), and even Frequency, although that didn’t involve actual people traveling in time, time was altered through communications through time. This Star Trek is probably the first to apply theories that most people are not aware of, and probably still not aware of even after watching this movie.
And yes, I do kind of agree that this is part of the reason why I don’t like comics as well, but hopefully this is the ONLY time this happens with Star Trek so it won’t be as confusing as comics. I do kind of see how this was the only way to revitalize the series while using characters fans already know. Otherwise they would have had to start from scratch. A traditional prequel sticking to the already existing timeline and continuity would have been very limiting. Look at the disaster the Star Wars prequels were because they had to give people something new while somehow ending where the old series could begin. Although a lot of that could be attributed to poor writing. I don’t know, I wasn’t liking where Star Trek has been going thus far, this new spin on the series is definitely much more interesting in my opinion.
@Ken J,
I kinda get what you mean. Phantom Menace wasn’t all that great. The only part of Star Wars prequel that I liked was to see how Anakin becomes Darth Vader… Back to the subject at hand…
Why not make a movie that solely focuses on their days in the Academy and end it with them finally getting on board of the Enterprise? I know that there needed to be change, and in a major way. But, and in no way do I mean to be disrespectful here, couldn’t they come up with something more scientifically sound? They are after all writing for the audience of Star Trek. I mean, that’s why they get paid the big bucks. I’m not saying that I hated the movie, I liked it. But it just leaves this bad aftertaste when I think about what this means to the original continuity – it gnaws at the back of my head. And I want to follow the original Kirk, Spock and Enterprise crew – not them form an alternate universe. I guess that’s what gets me the most.
Peace out y’all
@Andrew
Yah, I understand, I was merely explaining how this whole timeline thing affects the old timeline (or doesn’t affect it), not completely defending it, although I liked it, but that’s just my opinion.
Remember the TNG episode with the hundreds of Enterprises? I think that may have been the writers, in part, poking fun at the idea of alternate realities.
I’ve got an unorthodox favorite TNG episode, Time Squared. I thought that was a great take on breaking a loop. Then there’s Cause & Effect and The Next Phase–TNG visited time travel a lot, and I could care less about the quantum mechanics or alternate realities–it made for great science fiction–emphasis on fiction.
Speaking of favorites, no one’s brought up the Mirror Universe, a fan fave at LEAST in its first manifestation. DS9 did some interesting building on that (A bit elaborate for me). I think somewhere along the line, maybe in Enterprise, the origin of the Mirror Universe was shown. So no, Ken, JJ Trek was not exactly the first and only time alternate reality has been incorporated.
MOVIES, thought listing other movies would hint at that. There are plenty of Stargate episodes that also talked about infinite universes… Not to mention probably countless Outer Limits episodes…
@Gary
Maybe Nichelle Nichols just had a thing for Leonard Nimoy?
Hell I wouldn’t blame her!
@Ken J
All good in the hood homie
@ All:
I want to address a couple of things about this movie that may not’ve been discussed before, observations I have tried to make, not as a 40+ year ST fan (which I most certainly AM), but as a non-Trekker fan of many, many movies thru’ the decades:
First of all, I was blown away by the Kobayashi Maru No-win Simulation.
The young cadet, James Tiberius Kirk, WAS JAG lawyer Danny Caffee in ‘A Few Good Men’ – chomping on his apple as he calmly, confidently ate Cadet Commander Spock’s LUNCH. He knew Spock and the other faculty would be watching his every move; he also knew, as someone else said on here, that they KNEW he was cheating, they just could not figure out how.
Congatulations, Jim, you just became the only person – of any species – to ever beat the No-win Scenario. Enjoy your new set of steak knives. You earned it.
There WAS EVEN A ‘Colonel Jessup moment’, when Kirk tooka advantage (perhaps unfairly) of Spock’s pain to drive him to the unforgivable – forcing a Vulcan to blow his cool – and it got him the Big Chair.
Say whatever you want, but if yu ask me, Abrams has been paying attention through the years.
Secondly, I didn’t read any comic book, I don’t need any prequel to see a really good, exciting movie for an hour and a half without feeling like I just got SODOMIZED out of my ten dollars (I don’t know where they still charge only $7.50, must be a timw warp, lol), all I know is, I’m gonna see the next one, and if JJ is clever enough to bring butts back into the seats, more power to him.
As for the rest, in the words of the best damn actor in any film I’ve seen in a long time, Karl Urban:
“Damn it, Jim!
“I’m a DOCTOR, not a movie critic!!!”
See ya in hell, sailor,
JOHN
@ Ken J
“uh oh, don’t say that about Jason Statham, I have a friend that would hunt you down if he finds out that you said that about him, lol.”
Hehehe. Apologize to him if he ever reads it. Mind you, I’m a big fan of action heroes who can’t act.
@ Vic
The Spock Uhura Relationship was mainly in the books, as were the Scotty and Uhura relationship, but there was an Episode about Terran Fruit or something where Uhura confesses feelings for Spock in TOS.
So…I came away from the film with mixed feelings. I’m still sorting out my overall thoughts, however, wanted to bring up a couple of things.
First, as noted, supernova don’t threaten the galaxy. Ever. Also, the shockwave moves at sub-light speeds, so it would be hard for any supernova to threaten any planet not in its own system in any timeframe less than a year or so. (being that only large stars go supernova, and most planetary systems aren’t going to be orbiting hospitable stars which are also in close proximity to other large stars–the gravitational interactions would probably make the planetary system unstable over the long run). Most planets are many lightyears from most stars, and the shockwave sure ain’t going to be going even that fast.
Second, why did Future Spock need enough red matter to do about 10 gazillion black holes? Clearly all you need is a drop. That’s all he uses when he stops the supernova. 1 drop. Why bring a crapload of extra highly dangerous and unstable material with you?
Third, assuming we buy red matter, why do you need to drill a hole first? Just drop a container of it on the surface of the planet, sit back and watch. Much easier that way, and you can send that container on its way from a nice safe distance.
Fourth, was it just me, or was there a serious discontinuity in the interrogation of Captain Pike? His chair seems to be sitting in pool of water (why?). But, at one point, they show a birds-eye view of him in his chair, and the water isn’t there. They cut back to a side view, and you can clearly hear the sloshing and whatnot. I’ve only seen the film one time, but that continuity break was quite jarring.
Go to you tube.
search for Uhura singing about Spock.
She sang to him while he was playing the harp in Charlie X .
she even got him to SMILE!
re: why blow up the ship if it’s falling apart and being sucked into a black hole- i don’t think they knew that a black hole would be created. it was their first experience w/ red matter. i think spock mentioned it to young kirk as he explained how he came from the future but perhaps in all the commotion, he forgot- OR didn’t realize how strong it would be. maybe he thought the enterprise could outrun it.
@ Mike W
Remeber Kirk told Sulu that if the Enterprise had the advantage to fire, and that is what Sulu did. Also since the black hole could transport things in time it was an extra precautiont o make sure Nero wouldn’t return (at least that is how I viewed it)
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And FYI multiple Spocks from different parts of the time continuim can exist in the same instance of time in that reality. But because nero altered time he created an alternate reality so the old Spock wont fade away until its his time to die. Futher more Old Spock was supposed to be in his 400s since Vulcans live extremely longer than humans.
re: kirk getting court martialed instead of a commendation for the kobayashi maru-
don’t think it was a court martial, but more like a hearing-besides- we don’t know what the final outcome of that hearing would’ve been for it was cut short.
perhaps kirk did such a good job defending himself (he was off to a good start) that he convinced his peers and superiors that he deserved a commendation as opposed to a punishment. who knows,perhaps spock himself would’ve ended up suggesting the commendation for kirk’s original thinking that stumped spock himself of all people.
re: chekov being 17 after spending 4 years in the academy.
saw the movie again this weekend. pike said ” so, you’re supposed to be that russsian whiz kid” (or something to that effect) giving me the impression that perhaps chekov’s age can be explained via some doogie howser scenario…..
re: sulu mucking up warp speed- pike also said a line indicating that sulu was a last minute replacement for someone who contracted some flu. that explains why sulu was unfamiliar w/ the controls.
re: spontaneous romance between uhura and spock in the elevator- don’t forget, when she wasn’t assigned to the enterprise- she complained to spock- he explained that he intentionally didn’t put her on the enterprise, because he didn’t want it to appear that he was committing favortism. between that comment and the way she acted toward him, it was definitly hinting to a romance.
@eyrieowl
Your first, second, and fourth points are definitely well founded, and I noticed those too, but am able to look past them, but the third point I think is addressed.
The red matter and the strength/size of the black hole it forms seems to have a direct correlation with the amount of energy put into the red matter. Meaning if you let it sit there, nothing happens, if you shoot a missile at it and blow it up, it’ll form a black hole, but a small one, if you send it into the core of a planet where it makes contact with the extreme temperatures of the planet’s core, it’ll absorb that energy and form a bigger black hole.
At least from watching it that’s how it appears to work since them blowing up the red matter in Spock’s ship didn’t form a huge black hole, I attributed that to the relatively small amount of energy from the ship’s missiles compared to the greater amount of energy found within a planet’s core.
@ Ken J
Technically there should have been a huge black hole created since all of the red matter got ignited that was on Spock’s ship since there was more of it aboard.
I remember seeing a preview that showed Nero in a Klingon prison. I just hope there is a special edition extended directors cut. That’s the one I want to buy when it comes out on DVD.
re: klingon prison, i’ve read here that someone else read that for 20 , of the 25 years, nero was on the klingon prison planet. im curious how that came about. Rua Pente is the name of the planet, i believe. in star trek 6 the klingon warden who gave the speech stating “no watchtower, etc, etc” (which i believe is similiar to the speech in “bridge on the river kwai”.) ANYWAYS, i believe the actor who played the role of the klingon warden, was the same actor who played the vulcan who accused spock of having a “disadvantage” for being human (when he got accepted to the vulcan science academy) in the latest film. i don’t know the actor’s name, but i believe he was also the crossbowsman in “hawk- the slayer”- the sequel of which is rumored to star the actor who played picards clone in star trek nemesis…
@ mark,
were klingons shown in that scene that you saw? if so, i’m curious what they looked like….