March 25, 2009 | by Rob Keyes 

Sam Raimi Controls Spider-Man 4 (Unlike Spider-Man 3)

Spider-Man strangled by Venom

Did you like Spider-Man 3? I didn’t. Sadly, many fans of the Spider-Man franchise were let down by the third installment of the series but don’t fret! We just may get a return to form with Spider-Man 4.

In an interview with Empire for this May’s issue, Raimi openly talked about some of the problems with Spider-Man 3 and confirmed some rumors we all heard about two summers ago when the movie was released.

“They really gave me a tremendous amount of control on the first two films, actually. But then there were different opinions on the third film and I didn’t really have creative control, so to speak.”

There were rumblings that Raimi wasn’t allowed to truly do his own story and that producers forced him to include the popular Venom character as one of the villains in the story. When asked about that, Raimi responded:

“I don’t even want to comment on Venom, because I know he’s a great character and all the fans love him. I never want to say anything bad about a much-beloved character because usually it turns out that I’m the one that doesn’t understand what makes it great.”

It seems that the image above is more meaningful than at first glace…

More questions were thrown at the director about the issues surrounding Spider-Man 3 and the at-the-time Marvel head honcho Avi Arad’s rumored insistence on Venom’s inclusion, but Raimi responded professionally and didn’t name names or play the blame game in his answers.

“The best way for me to move forward on films, I realize…and this was a lesson I had to learn for myself…is that I’ve gotta be the singular voice that makes the creative choices on the film.”

It sounds promising that the next movie will return to the quality we’ve come to expect from the first two films in the franchise. I’m glad that Raimi is back in the captain’s chair (for real this time) and that Tobey will be back as Peter Parker. We also know that Raimi really wants Kirsten Dunst back as Mary Jane but no deal has been made on that front as of yet.

Morbius a villain in Spider-Man 4As for the villains of the next Spidey film; we know Raimi has an interest in Morbius and they’ve spent quite a bit of effort in developing The Lizard. So, we could be seeing those two in the story. I like those choices as villains as they go hand in hand as a pairing in the Spider-Man comics and both have very similar origins.

I definitely prefer that pairing to the recently rumored (originating from a fan site) Electro and Carnage combo which I think would be a poor decision. They need to avoid Carnage if they want to keep the suspension of belief and have a more realistic (as realistic as it can be for a superhero flick) movie experience.

Or at least, save Carnage for the fifth film.

What do you think?

Spider-Man 4 is set to open in theaters May 6, 2011.

Source: The Geek Files

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  • Xigbar
    I guess I was the only one hoping that the new Spiderman movie would reboot the franchise to integrate it into the Marvel Movieverse....
    With the side benefit of a maybe decent cast and director being brought in this time
    *steadies himself for the oncoming barrage*
  • Okay @Xigbar you're not the only one who wants to see what the Marvel studio would do if Marvel had the rights. They don't - the money from Sony is what pays for IM2, Thor and the rest. So dont be ungrateful.
  • And as to the franchise, it's not that bad that it needs a reboot. I love Raimi when he does have creative control. I like that he didnt point fingers but acknowledged mistakes were made. Love the idea of Morbius and Lizard - similar stories and wonderful possiblities. Maybe Carnage for 5 along with Electro or Kraven.
  • Gingerbeer
    Still doesn't excuse what they did with spiderman 3... What's he trying to say, they forced venom into the script. He could of adapted, dropped sandman or set up venom for Spiderman 4.
  • Tino
    Somehow I doubt the studio forced Raimi to make P Parker an emo crybaby with added dance numbers. Raimi is not completely blameless for the utter s**t moments that plagued SM3.
  • charles darwin
    I, for one, am getting fed up with these "multiple villain" movies, where they are forced to dumb down the evil characters, cut back on character development, and rush through origins. Carnage is the only logical move for the next movie, BY HIMSELF, since like it or not, they just did VENOM. Spidey fights a vampire? Lame. As far as the lizard goes, he was ok in the comics, but I'd like to see spidey fight more and more dangerous villains, not weaker ones, and he's already beaten Doc Ok all by himself.
  • JMoney
    I'd have to agree with Tino here, having Venom in the film didn't make Peter Parker into an emo loser, and having Venom in the film didn't force Raimi include dance numbers. Venom wasn't great in the movie, but when I think of why Spider-Man 3 sucked, Venom is not what comes to mind.
  • SK47
    I'm telling you guys, spider-man 3 is Raimi's big F-U to Sony! When the films are done his way, S-M1 & S-M2, they were great! You want to talk about realism and superheroes, Spider-Man 2 IS the example for that!
    This is good news that S-M4 is under Raimi's full control. I like the idea of Morbius, the great thing about Spider-man is that he can easily go from Fantastical "comic-book" villains such as Morbius and Electro then onto "real world" villains such as Hammerhead, Tombstone & even Doc Ock.
    I thought S-M3 and S-M4 were initially supposed to be a Venom arc. They did it so well in the Animated Series, they should have taken notes from that! In fact, go back to the animated series to see how to properly do a Morbius angle.
  • INK
    Do some of you honestly believe a person (Raimi) who can't stand the character of Venom is going to put Carnage, a less interesting villain, especially in a PG-13 movie, in his movies? Although I liked him, somewhat, in the comics. He was the cause of one of the greatest atrocity in a SPiderman cartoon. He made you have sympathy for Venom. Even moreso he changed Venom into a sort of quasi-hero. Runing the angst, danger, mystery and fear that he brought to the Spiderman comics.

    Just my opinion, though.
  • I believe Carnage would be a massive mistake, he does not appeal to mainstream moviegoers and after what happened to Venom, it doesn't make sense to go back to a strange and weird looking symbiotic-villain again.

    I'm sticking to my Morbius-Lizard theory/hope! :)
  • Raimi won't put Carnage in the film.

    I'm also not a fan of the multi-villain thing in movies, although as mentioned above, it CAN work (Both Dark Knight and Iron Man had two villains).

    I'm curious to see what Raimi does with Parker/Spidey in the next film - by the time they get to filming it Macguire will be 34/35 - hopefully he will have come into his own and will be more like the "mature" Spider-Man in the comics instead of the geeky "what's my role in the world" version.

    Vic
  • Darren seeley
    Well, let's get a few things clear:

    Not everyone hated Spider-Man 3. Yes, it wasn't as good as 2. Yes, there was too much hype around Venom, where the better idea would simply introduce Brock as the Harry/Goblin arc stepped down. Venom took away from Sandman, which was better handled, gave the film an interesting "issue" (Marko's involvement in the carjacking)...

    But what's done is done, and it is good to see Raimi wanting to change nothing but simply move on. However let's not let Sam off the hook just yet. Before Venom there was plans for The Vulture and that character was almost cast! So, please, folks, no more 'if Venom or Sandman were dropped '3' would be better due to fewer baddies. The number would still be about the same.

    As for Carnage, yes, it is possible that Carnage could appear...in Venom Oh, we, like, forgot about that proposed spinoff film or something? Seems to be the case. 'm not the biggest Venom fan, but I'm ALL FOR IT.

    See, Marvel's self produced films can tie in to one another, such as "The Avengers" films (Iron Man, Thor etc)

    The X-Men branches out to a bigger universe in X-Men style (Wolverine, Magneto, First Class, maybe Deadpool)

    So why can't a Spidey "universe" grow?

    I'm not saying I'm for every character having a spinoff film- but I'm just saying we don't need Carnage, but Carnage can still be useful in a slightly different film with some connection.

    And who up there said The Lizard isn't tough?
    Uh...okay...

    Anyway, if Sam wanted to use Stegron I'm sure he'd make him tough. Not that he'd use Stegron.
  • Andy S
    I'm going to agree with alot of the people here in that Carnage needs to stay out of the film, or at the very least wait until Spidey 5. I'd love to see Kraven the Hunter along with the Lizard, but I think that Morbius could be cool, too. The only part I REALLY hated about Spidey 3 was emo Peter. That was sooooo bad. The effects were cool, but the movie didn't seem to have any real direction. Hopefully with Raimi calling the shots we get another Spidey 2.
  • After the terrible third movie, I honestly don't know if I will see this 4th one.
  • Gary
    I am open to any other villains as long as the film is a symbiote free zone.
  • SK47
    Here is the main problem with Carnage, he is supposed to be the more evil version of Venom, giving that the host is a serial killer in Kletus Cassidy correct? So, a PG13 Carnage will not work! Considering you have the character basically being a T1000 by having his arms become stabbing & cutting weapons.
    stick to the original, you can have a wonderful story arc with The scorpion!
  • rail
    Echoing previous comments, I'm also not necessarily a fan of multi-villain superhero-flicks (two bad-guy whackadoos in costume seems to always up the camp factor), and Raimi alone does not guarantee a good Spider-Man flick (as noted, see the emo-Parker-dance-routine). However, Morbius and Lizard could work: this could loosely follow Amazing Spider-Man 200. The dumped Pete tries (again) to chemically rid himself of his powers blaming them for his woes (again), ends up with more spider-like ameneties (or maybe the 4 extra arms isn't a good idea?). The basic conflict of this flick being is he more "spider" than "man." Despite the allure of leaving his human side and problems and miseries associated therewith by conceding to the animal side, runs into Morbius, [who clearly is more 'vampire bat' than 'man', but who, let's say, revels in the more animalistic side of his nature or can't come back] and decides to fight for his humanity (I'm sure MJ is a factor here). And then the two probably battle for the soul of the Connors, a la Two face in "The Dark Knight"...or something. Anyway, Raimi's horror background and strengths could be a major plus in a Morbius-based plot, if the studio is willing to go at least PG-13.
  • Cali
    My problem with the spiderman series is that they always seem to want to go back to an origin story. Yes Parker is the tragic hero always battling with his great power great responsibility theory and the fact that he wants a normal life but you can only go back to Parker loses everythign and gives up being spidey for half the film until he is forced back into it so many times. Develop the hero now. Let spidey bust lose and actually enjoy being a hero at least for one film.
    I'm really surprised with the way 3 ended no one has mentioned anything about possibly tossing in the Felicia Hardy character AKA Black Cat to add some romantic turmoil in the mix and still adding a cool supporting character/villain/heroine.
  • Richard
    I think they could do carnage, maybe not in this film but the next one, maybe he kills Mary Jane and is a seriously f'd up serial killer and it could be a really really dark spiderman movie. I think that would kick ass, but not this close to Venom's appearance... man I love Venom, they should have done him much better. I guess the 3rd movie just sucked. Or maybe Raimi should have said ok I'll do Venom, just Venom and do it right, who knows.
  • Richard
    Also I'm a huge Spiderman man and have read many of his (mostly his, many others too tho) comics throughout the ages, and I cant remember one storyline, interesting piece of art or anything cool related to Morbius. I guess I missed something or hes not as great of a villain as people think. I personally think that Morbius should be way WAY down in the list of good Spiderman villians.
  • JessSayin'
    After seeing what Peter Jackson did with the audio and CG rendering of the reptiles in King Kong I think we are at a place where 'Lizard' could be presented realistically and totally believable on the screen.
    Hopefully bad-ass scary as well, (why not it'll be PG-13 for sure)

    Carnage...NOT! If he couldn't do Venom justice what makes you think he'll get Carnage right?

    Multiple villains? Just as many movies have sucked with as without.
    I hate it if no other reason than the lack of story and character development. Too many villains = Too much time

    There is enough tragedy in Lizards life to fill one whole movie.

    And when is Parker gonna FINALLY grow up, stop whining, embrace who he is and tell MJ to shut the heck up?!

    I'm sick of the crying!!
    (I'm done crying now...)

    Cali is right though..Black Cat would make a nice addition to a running relationship thing between Parker and MJ.
  • SK47
    Joshi, having to go "dark" on Spider-Man can be warranted because this is one character that can balance both sides of the spectrum. Light and Dark.
    Batman has to be dark otherwise it will be Schumacher.
    Superman can't work as a "dark" film because that is not the character.
    Spider-Man is one character that can shift both sides without complaints, I am reminded of the early Ditko work on Spidey. He was drawn more creepy.
  • vid
    The lizard definitely has to be in the next film. Morbius...eh don't care much for him and there are better villains than him. Kraven is ok and you could do a kraven's last hunt type story with the lizard taking vermin's place.

    Adding the black cat would be quite nice. Forget Gwen & Capt Stacy.

    If you were going to add a second villain which then I think it would have to be Electro. Although he lacks the intelligence/scheming of a goblin or doc ock.

    Lizard on his own could work but he's mostly portrayed as a mindless reptile. Let's face it a scheme to transform all humans into reptiles he can control is cheesy beyond belief.
  • Daniel F
    I don't know if I believe him or if it just seems like he is trying to cover his ass. I mean I thought SpiderMan 3 was crap, but to me it seemed like Sam had a lot of control because it reminded me of all the B movies he has done.
  • Fartie Lange
    no carnage! ever! i wanna see more of the classic Lee/Ditko villains on the bigscreen! Lizard! Electro! Vulture, who could be done in a really cool and creepy way in Raimi's hands! stick w/ the classics!
  • Matt
    save carnage for a fifth film? no, adapt venom the right way then adapt carnage
  • Titan
    See. I new from the beginning that something was up. I liked Spider-Man 3, but felt it lacked in build up and was rushed. When I left the theater, I new Sam wouldn't have degraded a Spider-Man movie from something like '2' on purpose. Just about everyone gave up on the franchise after one that didn't feel good with them? Jeez. Anyway it looks like NOW poeple are looking foward to the fourth. But I totally agree, the dance scenes where gut wrenching.
  • wes
    If the Lizard is in it, they would need a second villain because he's too mindless. I think Kraven would fit well. Raimi will probably use Morbius because of the horror angle. The first three movies used up most of Spidey's top villains. The second tier is what's left to choose from other than resurrecting a previously used one.
  • Luke Cage
    I'm not really into the "comment" thing. But, if there's a chance that it makes a difference: Please! no Morbius! We had enough vampires movies already!
  • Jism
    I want classic villains, like Raimi wanted in the beginning b4 he caved in.
    Vulture sounds great, as well as Kraven and the already set up Lizard. These are more "realistic"(at least as realistic as Spidey can get)villains an would make awesome eye candy.
    They use 2 out of these 3 and Spidey is gold again.
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