After a very long wait, and a somewhat disappointing second season, Heroes has finally returned for Season 3: Villains.
At the end of season 2, Sylar (Zachary Quinto) had just gotten his powers back, Noah Bennet aka “HRG” (Jack Coleman) had just gone back to work for “the company” in order to spare his family, and Nathan Petrelli (Adrian Pasdar) had been apparently fatally shot just as he was about to reveal his ability to fly to the world.
BTW, full-on spoilers in the review below.
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Heroes is run by folks (led by series creator Tim Kring) who actually listen to the fans, take their complaints to heart, and use that information to improve the show. This season there will be no slow, dragged out story arcs, and Kring says there will not be any new characters introduced (although this episode seems to contradict that). This season will also be comprised of two “volumes.” The first half of the season will be called “Villains,” but there is no title for the second half yet.
Enough of that… on to the season opener!
The episode opens with Claire (Hayden Panettiere, looking all “Matrixed” out in black leather) trying to kill Peter (Milo Ventimiglia), four years after Nathan’s announcement of his powers. Peter goes back in time to change the past, since it seems that things became very bad for super-powered beings after Nathan’s revelation.
So yes, the assassin is Peter Petrelli from the future.
Cut to Japan, where Hiro (Masi Oka) now owns his father’s corporation. He’s quite bored by the whole thing and yearning for a new quest. Of course, the show is happy to oblige. He watches a video left behind by his father stating that he needs to guard the contents of a safe (without ever opening it), the contents of which could lead to the end of the world. It is half of some sort of chemical formula.
Of course, he opens it.
A blonde girl who moves as fast as The Flash promptly steals it. And here lies the first thing that bugged me about this episode: Why didn’t Hiro just go back in time 60 seconds and put that piece of paper back in the damned safe?
Instead he goes to the future, sees his best friend Ando (James Kyson Lee) who is now super-powered kill him, and the destruction of Tokyo.
Nathan was dead for all of five seconds, but came back to life somehow - and claims to have seen God. I’m curious how they develop this and how it comes across to fans as he comes across downright born-again. Linderman is also back despite the fact that he seemed definitively dead during last season. Turns out he healed Nathan and has big plans for him.
Sylar finds Claire, intent on once again trying to take her healing power. He does the skull slice trick on her, sucks her powers… but surprisingly, leaves her alive after a very creepy scene in which he talks to her while he has the top of her skull off. Sylar tells Claire that she is not like the others - she is special and she can never die. And now, neither can he.
Suresh (Sendhil Ramamurthy) is with Maya (Dania Ramirez, who unfortunately is still on the show) and she still wants to be cured. He flashes on the idea that the abilities are not based in the blood but in the adrenal gland. Suddenly he shifts his research (and ridiculously quickly creates a serum) from curing super-powers to being able to give them to anyone via an injection.
(”Click here to continue reading Heroes Season 3 Premiere Review“)
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148 Comments
Okay………
I just watched the premier episodes and, after spending weeks anticipating a fresh new ( and hopefully better…) season 3, came away scratching my head a tad.
Is it me, or did the writers not think anyone would catch on to the very lame and obvious Seresh channeling Jeff Goldblum in “The Fly”? Right down to the wall crawling, I’m super exited and horny yet falling apart with icky goo scenes. I mean…COME ON GUYS! Are you so lacking in the idea department that you have to blatantly swipe from other works? Rediculous!
Make no mistake, I have high hopes that the show will return to the season one type of quality episodic puzzles, but what I saw tonight was a disjointed, uninteresting, unimaginative flop.
Spank me if I’m being too judgemental, but when the first course is filet mignon, and it’s follwed by tofu burgers and then minestronie, I need to bark at the chef, y’know?
keep the faith, y’all
M.W.L.
Spoilers. Lol.
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Wow great coverage Vic!
I was watching Prison Break at the same time during the first hour so you filled in some blanks for me.
I totally passed on the 1st hour NBC Heroes Pep Rally, and watched the Sarah Connor (desperate measure of the week) show instead…
what I did see of the pep rally looked pretty bad.
(Pandering to the mtv gen level) lol
Blocked it out.
Anyway,,,
Peter and Hiro keep making the big mistakes. Lol…
I thought the show was real good…!
Sure there were some big plot holes, but its Heroes,,,
(Watch the first 2 seasons, you’ll see a few plot holes)…
The action,and pace were great,,, it reminded me of the first season in some ways.
I was a little thrown buy Nikki at first, but then it all clicked with the reporter she later killed.
Did anyone see the X men homage in that scene. There’s even a line where Nikki says,”its a mistake” and it sounded just like “Mystique”. Very cool, and then the same actor in Xmen dies almost the same way “he did” in X1,,,, lol.
You said that there were no new characters but I did notice some in the 2nd hour.
lol.
So I’m thinking that Sylar and Clair NOW have the same powers, she just dosnt know it yet…
I loved that HRG is back in action, he’s prob my favorite character because he’s totally normal, yet all the “outcasts” fear him.
Great stuff, I like his direction. Speaking of direction,,, it seems this seasons arc is Time Travel,,,
It was one thing when Hiro had his little fun, but now Peter’s taking all kinds of liberties with our humble timeline…
Great direction!!!
I love this,, as it allows all kinds of possibilities with the direction of the Heroes and Villians storyline…
Also great to see Captain Sheridan in the show now!!!
Also you KNOW Sheresh just impregnated (everyones favorite character)…..
How’s that gonna play out???
Reminds me a little of BSG,,,
Last thing,,,
Anyone notice how GOD is now a BIG part of 3, Sci-Fi shows…Battlestar Galactica, The Sarah Connor Cronicles, and now Heroes….
Just something to note,,,
The name of Volume 4 is called “Fugitives”…btw Season 3 premiere rocked!
I thought it was good. However, I am getting a bit tired of the I-saw-the-future-and-it-sucked-so-now-I-have-to-change-it storylines. All three seasons have been based around this core idea.
At some point, I think I would like a season where the ending was unknown. Where they were battling a current crisis, and then watch the consequences play out from there.
“At some point, I think I would like a season where the ending was unknown. Where they were battling a current crisis, and then watch the consequences play out from there.”
Before you can do that, though, you have to get rid of the time travelers. If you don’t, everyone will be saying “why don’t they jump forward and see what needs to be fixed.”
Of course, the way things unfolded last night, the explanation that would be needed for that issue may well be forthcoming.
COOL!
I thought it was pretty good. Lotza powers & action and they cut way back on the lame romances.
It was only the first episode , so to all you doubters , lets give this thing a chance.
I thought this episode was awful personally.
I’ll list a few of the many issues this premiere presented:
———-
Claire and Sylar scene: In this scene Sylar gets into Claire’s home to get her powers. For some reason, he plays little games with her…since when does he play around with victims he’s trying to steal powers from when he can just hold her in place and cut open her head right away with telekinesis..Claire is 100% defenceless against this. In this rediculous scene, Claire hides in a closet…ohhhhh…a closet, kinda like in horror films right? I get it. So she uses a chain to keep the door closed and this somehow stops Sylar who just manipulated every object in the house, closing doors, windows, lights going out, furniture being destroyed…so ya, Mr. Sylar who can flip an armoured truck is baffled by this mighty wooden closet door so he turns his attention to HRG’s files on villains out open on the table for him to read. During this time, Claire takes the chains off the closet, opens it and sneaks up behind Sylar…this makese sense right? Because Sylar’s superhuman hearing which can even sense heartbeats couldn’t hear the chains, door opening or her footsteps right? Anyways, Claire’s super silent power overwhelms Sylar and she manages to stab him in chest with her superhuman speed i guess?…hmmm…Sylar can slow bullets and stop Time-altering Hiro from getting him with a sword but can’t stop ordinary claire from using a kitchen knife on him….very creative on the writer’s part.
———-
Hiro, Ando and destiny scene: Here is a scene which is so over-the-top it doesn’t even fulfill its comedic purposes. In this stupid scene, we see Hiro bored as heck, playing with time. We see the arms on the clock moving back and forwards and when he stops, we see Ando walk in. What?! We just saw time go forward and we didnt see Ando come in or the next guy who brings a video for Hiro to watch. Oh geeze, what an uncreative way to introduce a new quest for Hiro.
On the video, Hiro is warned to protect something and right away he disobeys out of curiousity which is a really cool idea (really really cool) and he gets this note with half the formula on a crappy piece of paper. Right away we’re introed to a new superfast character who nabs it from his hand. Wow, what great timing. Hiro immediately slows time (doesn’t stop it, just slows it) and follows her speed/sound trail. This scene only exists to use up alot of the way-too-high of a budget for this premiere. Why not pause time entirely…or hell just go back a few friggin seconds, you were JUST doing it HIRO!!! ahhh, this drive me nuts. The writers are so uncreative, and this is such a crappy way to introduce this plot line for Hiro and Ando.
On top of this stupidness, Hiro decides to jump into the future to see what the consequences of this were, to see if the world were a mess. In doing so he conveniently lands in the exact spot and exact time where future Hiro and future Ando are arguing in a very weak scene over the EXACT crappy piece of paper….simply amazing!….then future Ando shoots red lightning at future Hiro (I guess future hiro can’t use time properly either). This whole stupid scene is there to now create angst between present Hiro and present Ando…wow this is gonna be awesome, nothing like a bit of tension between best friends over a future lightning bolt stemming from a fully contradictory scene.
———-
Intro 4 years into future: Future Peter is running like crazy for quite a while then turns into a warehouse. If I had a teleportation ability I would port there rather than run…oh wait…Peter can Teleport….wierd. Anyways, he turns into the warehouse and we have Claire conveniently waiting and pointing a gun at him. Obviously this rediculous plan of trying to shoot someone who can stop time fails, and Peter dodges the bullet, takes the gun and travels back in time to shoot his brother. I would have just gone back a few minutes earlier to talk to my younger self and brother Nathan, but hey, I guess bullets can work too. This is a little stupid considering when future Hiro came back in time to talk to Peter it worked fine, when saving the cheerleader to save the world…and since future Hiro and future Peter are both following “the string theory” why did he not just do that? why does he have to MURDER his own brother?
———-
It is said often that the Heroes writers listen to the fans. I wholeheartedly disagree. The problem with season 2 was not the lack of action or special effects, it was the lack of development, direction and misuse of characters and their abilities. This premiere for volume 3 takes all of these problems to the Nth degree and doesn’t fix a darn thing. I do not care about a show only offering special effects.
The writers I think, have lost it, they tried so hard to present a fresh set of plotlines, but in such a cop-out uncreative way. Let’s see what we have: Another Ali Larter personality that doesn’t know about her other selves and her son Mika, Nathan’s sudden faith-crazed self and getting back into politics while having a dead character talk to him in his mind, Future peter putting present Peter INSIDE the mind of a criminal (what an amazing idea), Parkman in a dessert meeting someone who knows him and the future, Hiro and Ando chasing after the Speedster by putting a tracking device on the medal…what does that do, they already know where she lives, she doesn’t take the friggin medal with her everywhere she goes (what the heck is going on), we have Claire exactly the same and emotional, this time without feeling pain, and we have Sylar who can’t die now.
I know this posts makes me sounds like the biggest hater, but I’m not. I just don’t get why so many people are saying this premiere is great and reboots the franchise in a way. I think the visuals are distracting alot of people’s memory of the full episode and story or something. Here are some examples of that, HRG and wife bring in Claire’s real mom to babysit…she walks to the front hold her hands out and starts a fire…wow, what a realistic and cool way to greet your daughter, with a serious face and hand full of fire? What are these writers thinking? I would of liked to be on set for that scene - shaking my head. Then at the gas-station scene where blue-pyro burns the innocent, he then talks to Peter-inside-big-baldy and talk to him while holding his right arm up right a fist full of fire again. What?! Who the heck would talk like that. I get it, Your special effects team has lots of money…thats really cool.
All this premiere did was extend the visuals on all the powers, we saw a room full of blue lightning, Ando shoot red lightning, a speed trail with stopped time, bullet-time effects, brain examining, blue and orange fire and a Jeff-Goldbloom-spiderman combination demonstration. We saw some of the characters, completely out of character with Nathan, Maya, Nikki, Suresh and we saw all the logic in any scene completely not followed with regards to characters and their powers.
Of all this stuff we were presented with in this episode, the only good thing is villains on the loose and that SHOULD be the focus, but that takes up about 4% of the show so what a waste. On the other side, there is no team or direction for the ‘heroes’ so what is the point, who is going to battle the baddies? Just HRG?
Vic, in your post you mentioned no new characters, we have the new speedster and 4 new villains. I also here they casted the Petrelli father so he will make an appearance this season, and I hear they are killing off Monica’s character from season 2. Another thing I heard is that Seth Green and friend from Robot Chicken will be making some appearances in the show as two comic book geeks.
Anways, I am a big fan of the show, but thought this premiere was not good. The main focus should be on the villains and we got to little of that and so much other crap. I think the writers and Kring should go back to their original idea of continuously killing off characters to make the danger and powers more effecive and realistic. I’m tired of the misuse of all the character we have, and why does the show have Time as such an important element when it is never used correctly, and instead used contradictory. I can go on and on and on, heh.
What I would most definitely like to see is the FINAL END of this Sylar guy.
I mean, get rid of hime for good. I’m getting bored of him always trying to steel everybodies powers. When they killed him in season 1 I was like “finally he’s gone” but no, they had to bring him back.
Why oh Why ?
The ratings were overall pretty low for Heroes.
I can’t believe 20 million ppl watched “Dancing with the Stars”…
Wow its clear that a lot of ppl (20mil), are seriously mentally disturbed…
I’m done with this show. Just horrible.
The writers seriously need to turn this show around. Season 2 was complete mess. And based on the first 2 episodes of season 3, it seems that nothing has changed. they completely changes the characters( nikki, nathan, maya, mohinder just to name a few). I can’t stand Peter Patreli. He was one of the most powerful characters on the show but he couldn’t beat sylar. When you think about it, both Peter and Hero could have easily killed Sylar. Chop him in several pieces with Hero’s sword and dropped them in different time lines and voila, no more Sylar. The writers needs to slow down a bit and focus on the characters. I don’t need to write all the stuff I hated with first 2 episode of this season since they have been mentioned already. Heroes has the potential to be one of the best shows on tv, but the bad acting, writing and story are taking this show down the hill
Jury is still out for me. Didn’t we already do the whole bad future/time travel schtick? Tension has been lost because any time things go south, one of the characters will time travel and reset things.
The relationships on the show are being changed nilly-willy for the sake of drama ie lets throw everyone into the character blender and see what we can come up with.
I’m still watching a couple of more weeks but right now I’m fearing a Bobby Ewing stepping out of the shower - its all been a dream moment.
Monday doesn’t look like a good day ratings wise for genre shows. Terminator is struggling as well even though it hasn’t had the dip in quality (yet) that Heroes experienced.
Both I think are suffering because of Monday Night Football. Terminator comes on during the 2nd half of the game and Heroes just as its wrapping up. I bet both shows are heavily downloaded and on mnay tivo lists.
Sylar will always be involved in heroes, because Angela Petrelli is Skylar’s mom.
Gheesh I think Angela Petrelli’s my mommy too.
Did she shapeshift at the end or was that the beer ?
“Did she shapeshift at the end or was that the beer ?”
lol!
I thought the premier stumbled a bit too. It seemed that the writers still had a hangover from lower second season ratings, so they didn’t know what to do. Something will have to be seriously screwed up with the time stream in order to stop Peter and Hiro from constantly moving back and forth in it uncontrolled. It does seem to be getting to the point of ‘oh we’re jumping through time again this season too?’ I just thought the power stealing serial killer was a simpler concept. Maybe Sylar needed to be kept mysterious for a while longer. Maybe everything did. In the first season, a lot of the appeal was the mystery of it all, with Suresh as the central character trying to figure it out. Now they’re just turning him into one of the freaks.(He did come up with that serum pretty fast, along with a sudden loss of conscience.)
Rob, thank you for writing that. Now I don’t have to spend my time writing it. Wow, I thought you were gonna get some blowback from your review (Hey Vic, I’d like to have more review from you, and less summary. These shows were as sucky as Transformers, in many ways.)
Rob, one thing I didn’t appreciate was you mentioning, with no warning, about a character death coming up. Have a heart, guy.
I sure thought Tom was caught in a mindscape like his father did.
Angela finally confirmed her core power: Dreams. Remember when Peter was in jail as a suspect of killing the cheerleader, and he had that vision (dream)? I thought he was manifesting someone’s power, and it was his mother’s. In fact he dreamed in the first episode–of himself flying.
Rob, e-mail me? boundingsquirrel at yahoo dot com
Did they have a stand-in for Mohinder’s upper body?
I have this image of what a geeky professor type looks like, and it’s NOT Mr. Ripped & Chiseled.
What’s up with ‘Jessica’ being alive and having a different power? From promo shots during the summer I knew they were going to bring her back. Nathan as well–although I thought they were going to use Claire’s blood–which has already gotten too much play.
A thought about Clair standing in front of trains…over and over? That’s really peachy keen for an indestructible gal, but too bad she never thought of the shock and grief of the engineer(s) on the train, not to mention the calamity that could happen if they slammed on their brakes and piled up the cars. (I saw it in Hancock)
Just How many alternate timelines are we talking about ?
is the timeline Hiro visited the same that peter came from?
Sometimes its hard to tell .
“perhaps the choice of one word over another can change the entire aspect of the future. The vision of time is broad, but when you pass through it, time becomes, a narrow door.” Loved the way Herbert wrote it..
I think SkyNet has taken over because I just typed a lot of stuff and when I tried to post it, I got the “Page cannot be found” message. Where are you John Connor!?
I liked the episode but definately agree with a lot of what you all are saying (or should I use “yute’s” instead of “you all”
). The time-travelling thing is getting dated, so get away from it. I suppose Hiro doesn’t want to change the past anymore (like in “The Time Machine”) because of his conversation with his father but I’m sure going back and stopping himself from opening the vault wouldn’t have had bad effects.
Someone mentioned Sylar should have used his advanced hearing; from what I saw, Sylar only got his original powers back (telekenesis). I suppose Angela Petrelli being his mom solves the “why they hadn’t killed him” question.
The whole thing with Suresh is definately ripping off “The Fly”. I can see Suresh eventually using the gene to give normal people powers but it does seem too soon for him to come to this realization.
It’s possible that the Ando Hiro saw in the future is actually Sylar, or some other shape-shifter.
Someone mentioned Jessica; that wasn’t Jessica nor Nikki, but another incarnation. The new power even surprised her; it’s possible she always had it but it just now manifests itself.
All in all, I enjoyed the show but think they need to stop the time travelling stuff.
1. Suresh’s Super Serum (TM) reminds me of the Super Sucky “The 4400.” I can hear the famous Fox movie trailer voice-over guy:
“In a world where everyone has superhuman abilities…is anyone really special?”
Suresh getting powers is simply pandering to the juvenile audience. What human characters are in the show? Tom’s wife is out of the picture. Everyone’s relative turns out to have powers. Even Claire’s classmate turned out to be a flying doofus.
It stretches even comic book credulity to have the only non-powered people in the show be like the tabloid reporter or the gas station guys or the muggers (btw, hints of racism and CRASS “ebonics” stereotyping?)–simply showpieces for the villians’ destructive amusement.
Ahh good points,,, Kahless.
It should be fun to watch this year,,,
I hope the fans don’t continue to pick apart every little bit this season…
Yeah JC, its becoming apparent (pun intended), that our young Heroes are all linked by experiments done by the company.
(Insest, yeah prob, in a lab senario)
The show has huge untapped prequel material.
STYLE,,,, nice work,, wow this is a Screen Rant Exclusive !!!!!!
I’m gonna read this more closly when I get off work.
I think this story is going to be huge!
Thanks STYLE for letting us in on this !!!!!!!!!!
This sure could suck for Tim Kring.
790, It does suck for Tim Kring,
Tim Kring could also be looking at prison time.
copyright infringement is against the law.
Here’s something for you to think about:
There are over 5000 superheroes in Marvel comics and there’s not one Artist that can paint the future in Marvel comics,
It’s a pioneering character, that’s why it was so important for Tim Kring to claim it as his own and pretend he was next Steven Spielberg.
The man is over 50 years old and by Hollywood standards he’s still a wannabe, but Tim had a plan,,,,,,,
stay tune for more info posted on this site.
Well, I’ve heard nothing but great praise for Kring.
(Even that he’s a nice guy).
If this is true I don’t think he’s looking at jailtime, if anything these artists are in for a huge out of court settlement. If that happens the case might stay out of the mainstream…
But this is still great coverage. Thanks again STYLE , this really adds insight as to why the show has U turned. Fasinating.
Save the CAPS LOCK,
Save the
Screen Rant Audience.
haha, JC, I will e-mail you.
and a big LOL to 790 for the beer-petrelli-mom-shapeshift comment
Thank you Thriller, Mike and jc in chicago for your agreement
And JC, i totally apologize (I guess you’re referring to the Monica thing which I head from an interview mentioned in a podcast), I was in full rant mode. And to top it off, I wrote that entire monster of a comment, then I wanted to check something that vic said so I scrolled to top, hit page 2 and lost EVERYTHING. I was very upset to say the least. So the second time around, I FLEW through it, lol.
John “Kahless” Taylor, I don’t think Sylar just got his original power back - because his original power is understanding how things work (mechanical things and biological). Telekinises is just one of they many powers he has harvested (the first one, yes). So if he got that back, he should have all his powers back (ice, hearing, liquidation, radiation, etc.)
And Typhon, these shows had better ratings on mondays during football in prior season(s) so im not entirely sure football is the problem. I LOVED the first season of Terminator, and similar to Heroes was very disappointed by its premiere 3 weeks ago. What is with the rediculous bickering and attitude with John Connors and his mom. After all the crap they’ve gone through, John still acts so bad with his mom. That whole thing of him having faith in the terminator unit because she got all emotional and said she loved him…what is that all about? Does she have an emergency emotion chip that activates only when crushed by trucks, lol.
My big rant up above was not meant to make the show sound like the worst thing ever, its to show that ALL of the problems from before remain and some got worse. I think alot of websites and TV mags are ignoring alot of the problems. Throwing more money at the big premiere I also think added more pain to it.
790,
The Twins were on the radio recently in NYC talking about the lawsuit and they didn’t seem interested in a settlement, they want to go before a jury and we don’t blame them.
They don’t sell their art work, the show at Hunter college was free and they made that very clear at the show.
Tim Kring could indeed go to jail, read the copyright laws.
If Tim was a nice guy, He wouldn’t have pretended that his character Isaac Mendez was his original work when there was a story running in the NY Daily News August 5, 2004. about an African artist that could paint the future named Enjai Eele,
Whether we believe The Twins can paint or write the future or not, their story was still published years before Tim Kring.
The Twins had on display an article and cover story from Russell Simmons ” One world “magazine from 2001 about their ability to paint and write the future.
Everyone knows Russell Simmons is the founder of Def Jam records, only the biggest Hip-Hop label in the world,
connect the dots 790, you’ll see the timeline between the show’s story lines and the lawsuit, It’s one of the reason Santiago Cabrera was Missing in action at the pre-view party.
If an African artist that could paint the future was suing you, would you as a writer introduced Usutu, the African artist that can paint the future?
you have to feel bad for the actors on Heroes…….
to be tied to such a lame show.
Hayden, Masi, Milo and all the rest of those talented kids deserve so much better
And by the way, The Twins were asked on the radio if Wendy and Lisa is the soundtrack for their story? The Twins said no, their soundtrack? Lil Wayne.
He’s their cousin.
Yeah, this lawsuit is going to be very interesting,,,,,,,,,
Lollipop Baby!!
Knowing “a little about the law”, I decided to look into this a little myself and found the summary judgement and the opinion:
http://www.nylawyer.com/adgifs/decisions/121107cote.pdf
Well protected within our rights, is the right to submit for litigation any public dispute over property. We also have the right to appeal any such judgement made upon that litigation. However, in order for the appeal to matter, it must be proven that there were either 1) Significant errors made by either attorney during the process of the case, 2) Procedural errors during discovery, litigation, or trial that would substatially impact judgement, or 3) Significant facts have either been uncovered or ignored that will significantly impact judgement.
After reading through the summary judgement and reading the other facts surrounding the case and others that are similar to it, I cannot see anything that would convince the NY appellate court to over turn a summary judgement by a District Judge.
Style, I must admit, there are some striking, albiet basic similarities in the subject matter between some of the elements of Heroes and The Twins. But as the Judge points out, that making a judgment for the plaintiff on these basic similarities would be irresponsible: “The absurd results that
would follow from holding otherwise need not be enumerated.”
To illustrate and example: Let us say that we have two novels having a mysterious character who uses magic to fight against an ultimate evil being intent on ruling the world, and only one man/person/being is able to help this person because they are the one person able to use/find the one ring/sword/etc that can defeat the ultimate evil. Are they the same work? Is one infringing upon the other? If so, you better tell Terry Brooks to sue Robert Jordan, or for that matter for the Tolkien Estate to sue everyone. for that matter, you better shut down the entire science fiction genre of writing because they all apparently steal from one another. For those of you who doubt it, they have never read any fantasy novel.
In the end, while it might be something of a smear against the creativity of the writers that they cannot come up with unique material on their own, to say that they patently infringed on them is almost laughable. Read the summary judgement, do not just take my word on it. It shows, in my opinion a judge making a very good point by point assessment of the lawsuit and why it does not meet the criteria necessary to be considered an infringement.
As far as the first couple of episodes of Heroes…I liked them and am eager to see them against the backdrop of the entire story arc, and not just on what has transpired thus far.
Peter from the future is not who he appears to be. The Peter facade is just a projection. Beneath all the tinkering and good intentions and tinkering and attempts to fix things and make them all better (I’m sure most of you have figured out already), his true identity is…
spoilers?
…he’s Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. Can’t keep his hands off private enterprises, violates “prime directives,” tries to negate the “you reap what you so” actions-and-consequences principle of the ages.
You REALLY need to change the email address you’re using when you comment here. Your inbox is full and I continually receive Mail Delivery Error messages from every post in which you’ve commented. I’m tired of getting all those so PLEASE use a VALID email address to comment!!!
Vic
Directly from the judgement:
Plaintiffs focus particularly on the
similarities between Idai from The Twins and Isaac Mendez of Heroes, noting that both (1) are “minorities” (Idai is African-American and plaintiffs presume Issac Mendez to be Latino), (2)have the ability to “paint the future”; (3) often paint in oil on large canvasses; (3) create depictions of “two landmark New
York City buildings being destroyed” (Idai the Twin Towers, Issac the Empire State and Chrysler Buildings); (4) create
paintings of a bus being destroyed in the future, which prediction is then validated in a newspaper article; and (5)
attempt to stop the destruction of those buildings.
In addition, (1) painting a future in which tragic and destructive events take place, such as the destruction of landmark buildings in New York City; (2) having a prediction confirmed by a newspaper report; and (3) making an attempt to prevent a tragic event in light of a prediction of the future,
are simply “scenes a faire, [or] sequences of events that necessarily result from the choice of a setting or situation, [which] do not enjoy copyright protection.”
I do not mean to make this blog about this lawsuit, but when I see a poster try, in such a heavy-handed way, try to insinuate that the law was obviously broken and that the creators of a show millions enjoy are one step from prison. It is this kind of blatent attempt to smear the creators of the show, and discredit the show itself is annoying, especially when I have seen the exact same post on like 4 other sites, all in caps, just like this one.
STYLE, maybe you are not directly involved with this case or the plaintiffs, maybe you just hate copyright infringement, but in either case, please make sure you tell the right story.
I am sure that Issac’s storyline ending (which was seen by Hiro in the future in episode 5(?)) had nothing to do with the lawsuit. In fact, his talent “lives on” in both Sylar and Peter. (and now apparently two others) Additionally, is Santiago Cabrera’s absence from the pre-party any different than the absence of Tawny Cypress(Simone), Jayma Mays(Charlie), or Nora Zehetner(Eden); other actors whose characters where killed during season one? Or for that matter, would they continually refer to his work throughout season two? Please have some perspective, and at least try not to distort the reality of the situation.
I miss the quality writing from Season 1 in Heroes… Season two was like a bad case of “Good morning honey… yet it was all a dream… that’s what happens when you pass out after your crack pipe is empty”…
Then the first episode of Season 3, is “Hello… do you want to smoke another crack pipe with me?”
How many times can we go through the same story with different takes?
Don’t get me wrong I love the idea.. but eh… how about some new stuff?
It’s all a mess now…
PS. 790… Babylon 5 is AWESOME!!!!
WE LIVE FOR THE ONE… WE DIE FOR THE ONE!!!
LMAO!!
You know, I think my wife would agree - she was kind of confused by the whole thing.
Vic
Helloooo Vic!!!!
Tell your kind and wonderful wife… that soon… I mean soon, I’ll be making T-shirts with that sentence…. then we can both wear it and when people ask us what it’s about… We’ll gladly spill the beans on that one!!!
It’s good to hear I’m not the only one confused by what it once was to what it is today…
Tell her, if this keeps on going… Time to take the blue pill and forget about Heroes season 2 and 3 all together…
Its going to be interesting STYLE,,,
Again thanks for posting your info,,,
LORDY!!! Vic, I can’t tell you how much more compelling this thread was than season 2 or the premier episodes.
The input by the gang thus far has had me chewing on my mouse pad, no kidding!
I wish I could bottle such insightful and interesting observations and mail FOX the tiniest piece.
Thank god for this site and “The usual suspects” (you know who you are…)
YOU CHAPS ROCK!!!
M.W.L.
NoWhereman, thanks to STYLE, this has all come out, until proven wrong I have to give him BIG props for breaking this story,,,
I have been busy checking with MY sources, and its looking like STYLE, just broke the biggest story in reguards to Heroes, in a long while…
What ads validity to his comments is how troubling Ergo-Proxy’s comments are…
I can’t believe the show is about to impload. I hope everyones wrong on this,,,,
@ 790: While STYLE “broke” the story on the litigation on this site, it has been out there for 8-9 months on other blog/news sites, even those not dedicated to Heroes.
On the following sites, information regarding this lawsuit and judgement are supplied. Please read, and take note of a certain ALL CAPS submitter who insists that Heroes is a pile, Kring is a criminal, and the judge is a racist…among other things.
http://www.filmjunk.com/2007/03/19/nbcs-heroes-faces-copyright-infringement-lawsuit/
http://www.heroespodcast.com/2007/03/20/new-lawsuit/
http://reporter.blogs.com/thresq/2007/12/heroes-suit-is.html
Normally, I would pass by something like this and just let it go, but it bothers me that some of you have so blindly accepted these comments of this “new, breaking story” as providing all the factual data. I just want to make sure everyone knows everything, and keeps their eyes and ears open.
Finally, yes, the first two hours might have been better, but let us all have a moment to consider where the first two hours of season one left us? We know more now, yes, and so much more should be expected of the program, yes, but I am of the opinion that everything cannot be judged just on the basis of the first two hours. Remember that even something as cool as Sylar was not fully developed for several episodes in season one.
Heroes may still fall flat on its face…ruined by the unrealistic hype machine, uninspired writing, or even bad management, but lets at least give it a little while to find its legs before we chop them out from underneath it.
Thanks for bringing some balance to this story.
Vic
“Sylar will always be involved in heroes, because Angela Petrelli is Skylar’s mom.”
Now that’s a twist I would rather not have seen in this otherwise great show.
I mean it was OK to have Sylar in season 1, but why oh why bring him back in season 2 and then also make him the son of one of the main characters. That means we will probably NEVER get rid of this stupid parasite.
Please writers, get rid of him once and for all.
Wait…
How is that possible… Sylar’s mom is Petrellis mom?
When did this news come out? I’m confused…
@Realmwalker, I hadn’t heard anything on this story until yesterday, so I was a little shocked.
(Thanks for the info, I’ll check those links out).
I for one don’t want Heroes to fall on its face, and the last thing I would want would be Kring in jail,,,
Funny thing is that this happens all the time in this town.
Speilberg gets sued all the time for copyrite infingenment.
Some say its a rite of passage, and a mark of success?
Go figure,,,
Welll…
I might be angry about the turn out of Season 2 and maybe 3… but I still love Season 1!!!! It’s one of the best things of that year and I’m sorry that it had to be ruined this way…
After watching the first episode this morning again, I have to say, I don’t want the show to get cut, but then at the same time, I don’t think it’s wise to keep dragging it along if it’s already dead.
As for Tim, I don’t wish him to suffer anymore than he’s already suffering… I know he’s a nice guy, so I’m starting to think he was just used… used by NBC to promote the wazoo out of this show and while doing all of that, never letting him work out the main soul of the show…
Tim, probably has enough trouble, to actually throw him in Jain for this is a bit far out… If it DOES happen, I think fans should petition to get him our asap!
This whole thing might have been ruined by greed and NBC’s over zealous marketing department… They spent AAAAALOT on this show… The pushed it when it cannot be pushed and now they’re paying the price…
Ergo Proxy,,, the very last scene was the reviel on Sylars mom.
Funny Sylar was just as surprised as you,,,,
I guess the woman that Sylar killed was just someone who took care of him. Why Ms. Petrelli gave him away needs to be answered; and will Sylar try to kill her to gain her power?
IIIIIIIIIIII’M DUMB!
I just shot my self in the foot and it’s BLEEDING!!! Why is it Bleeding? Cause it seems I don’t heal from asking the wrong questions….
Meaning I misses episode II!!!!!!!!!!!! THAT’S WHY I’M IN THE DARK!!! FRAK!! I’m so stupid.. I just ruined the surprise moment… ahhhhrrrgrhhh..
Oh well… thanks Master 790… it at least clears up a vast hole I might have gotten had I not checked that there was ANOTHER episode!!!
Ooops. Sorry Ergo, I didn’t realise they prob didn’t show the first 2 episodes worldwide.
Yeah it was technically in the second episode.
Oh man, Ergo, you missed the turtle then! See if you can view it on nbc.com; that scene was funny.
Kahless… I am SOOOO looking forward to seeing this episode!!!
I MUST HAVE IT!!!
I shall return as soon as I’ve seen it..
I’ll watch for the turtle scene…
That’s why my review ends at the scene where Suresh is peeling scabs off his back - I missed the Sylar revelation, talking turtle, future painter African guy and all that!!
Vic
790,
stay focused… the people posting on here do not know all the facts. Most may even work for NBC or hope to work for NBC. On some sites, Tim Kring has responded to our posts.
A movement in London started months ago about this lawsuit and their are many of us worldwide that are posting to let the world know the truth about this heinous crime.
Some of the people posting on this site are not lawyers and have not read all materials submitted by both sides in this lawsuit.
It’s really interesting to read the emotional posts here by some people, that until a few days ago knew nothing of this lawsuit.
SMEAR? Tim Kring has taken an ancient art form and turned it into a poorly written cartoon.
He smeared and stole someone else’s work.
How can one smear a man that’s pretending his work is original when his work is in the local newspaper a year before he claims he came up with the “ORIGINAL IDEA”.
And who cares about the LOCK CAPS and all the other silly rants posted on this site to distract from the truth. that Tim Kring stole those artists work.
It doesn’t matter what anyone of us thinks, what matters is what the Appellate will rule.
790, My money is on The Twins.
they’re the real deal, not Tim Kring.
I know what I saw that night at Hunter College, I work in the tv and film industry and i know what Heroes is. And what it IS ,” is STOLEN.”
and ranting on this site is not going to change that fact.
I’ll post more info as I get it. and hey 790, thanks for your intelligence and for being open minded.
stealing does happens all the time in Hollywood, but this time Hollywood stole from the wrong people. The Twins has a huge under ground fan base, “Twin Heads” are every where. It’s a movement, so you’re going to see us on tons of sites.
The judge in this lawsuit violated several civil procedures in this lawsuit and any third rate appellate attorney could make that fact clear. Talk to one .
Has anyone on this site read NBC’s or the plaintiffs papers submitted into the appellate court lately?
It seems some of you have only read the judge’s decision in the lower courts.
Well……. that’s old news.
To Ergo and Realm:
Here’s something for you to think about.
Santiago was part of the original star line up with Milo, Hayden, Masi etc.., his power on the show was the map for the other Heroes.
He should have been at the pre-party.
The other actors mentioned in your posts were not hyped to the public $$$$ the same way as season one’s Heroes.
The power jumping from Hero to Hero is poor writing and you will notice the power was no longer an important element of the show as the show moved forward. Why? Thanks to the lawsuit Tim could no longer lift story lines from those artists work and NBC didn’t feel they had to totally remove the power from the show because as you can see from the judge’s decision , NBC is riding on “The artist that can paint the future is a mere idea”.
You’ll also notice that the judge agreed with every word NBC wanted her to . That’s a violation of those artists civil procedure, because the law states that the judge is suppose to look in favor of the plaintiffs, look up the law and ask a appellate attorney. Don’t take my word.
Isaac’s power on the show was a pioneering power not fully developed in any other tv show or film in history, anywhere.
790, Name the NYC artist that could paint the future on canvas and used those paintings to try and stop a tragedy against two buildings in NYC in any past film or tv show?
You can’t 790. The first was Isaac Mendez on Heroes September 25, 2006.
The Original? Idai Markus in One world magazine 2001, the Boston globe 2001, the NY Post 2002, The NY Daily News August 5, 2004 and the list goes on and on till the break of dawn on a bang bang boogie to the beat and I am Wonder Mike and I’d let to say Hello…………
The truth of this is so real, that if Idai Markus moved into Isaac Mendez’s old art studio, Idai wouldn’t have to get new monogram towels with new initials.
work out the main soul of the show?
Well,,,, The main SOUL of the show is The Twins: Journey Of The SOUL”.
And that’s what i’ve been trying to tell you,,,, Ergo
the lawsuit stopped Tim Kring from opening up those artists
book and “working out” the SOUL of a lame stolen show called Heroes.
But cheer up dear, I hear NBC maybe in talks with The Twins to come on the show and consult on story lines.
And remember next time you see “an exclusive “on ScreenRant, respect it!!
This site has much respect and we’re not going to waste time posting anything but the truth on this site.
@ STYLE:
Insinuating that I must be ignorant of the facts, not a lawyer, or (gasps) an NBC employee in order to disagree with your opinion (and that is exactly what it is) with my opinion (again all I claim it to be) is silly.
First of all I am not an employee of NBC, nor do I ever wish to become one.
Secondly, I am an attorney, and while my specialty is not in copyright law but in criminal law, both criminal appeals and civil appeals work under the exact same premise and guidelines. I would guess that my knowledge of what is actually occuring under law, is probably pretty accurate.
I think that the facts in this case are not all that unclear. The Twins have their product, and NBC has theirs. They are similar enough to where the Twins felt it necessary to exercise their right to due process under law. And they did. And they lost. They then exercised their right request a hearing to determine whether they can appeal the judgement. This is still to be decided. Realize that this is a two step process, first the appeal needs to be accepted, and then they have to win the appeal.
This process is not as easy as it may sound. You have to get an Appellate court to find “significant cause” to review the case. And you get one shot at it.
Also, you said that Kring might see jail time. False. This case is a civil dispute, and he has not been accused, prosecuted, or even charge with a crime. You need to stop trying to sensationalize this and stick to the legal facts in the case. Even if the plaintiffs in this case win, it will never result in any jail time for the defendants. If you are going to accuse people of not having the facts, it would be much better for you if you were to get them straight yourself.
Honestly, I am all for someone protecting their hard work from exploitation within the parameters of the law. The Twins have exercised their rights and no one is preventing them from doing so. However, they do not own a patent on “people who paint the future”, an idea that has been used in numerous other forms long before the Twins. Yes, it smacks of unoriginality and yes, it could even have been a direct result of them hearing of the Twins, but since they (the Twins) cannot hold a copyright on “someone who predicts the future by painting it” there is no case.
Furthermore, did you happen to see the CBS show Fringe this week that had a guy that scribbles pictures of future terrorist events? Are the Twins going to sue CBS too? Or do you think that Heroes has a case against Fringe?
Hey but wait STYLE…
I respect this site… Unless I OD’d on Pancakes and only then, I might get a sugar rush that would make me think that Superman Returns was actually a good movie… (scary.. I hope it never comes to that!)
Anyway, thank you Style for sharing this vital info with us. I for one have to say, the first season was great, everything there after was a free fall… I mean it was dreadful and as a writer, I spotted right off the bat that there was something really wrong with the writing team on the show.
It wasn’t due to the writers strike, I was certain of that… it was just badly written and in this case badly adapted from another story which they had to tippy toe around, in order to not get caught… but alas, creativity ran out and it became painfully obvious that the show wasn’t very original when it came to it’s “Creator”.
But yeah, I’m fascinated with the progress of this mess… I need to know more… in particular, how NBC could let this happen.
Isn’t it time to say “Ok, fans… we messed up… It’s time to hire new minds to branch out the show from it’s original concept.”
Anyway, I’m still hoping for a quick and painless solution… mostly because those hired on the show WILL loose their jobs if they cancel and that’s sad.
It’s not like the show isn’t able to bounce back… but that means they have to be honest and say… we’re going to sit down and actually mend the show… which in my opinion they haven’t done since the first two episodes in season 3.
It’s just a mess.
But thanks for keeping the story alive and telling us what’s going on with the show.
If you could share some vital links to these other stories I’d love to read more about them.
Have a grand day!!
I am sorry, but STYLE, you are wrong…the entire second season was focused around Issac Mendez’s last 8 paintings, as well as Peter’s own ability to paint the future. I do not think that the lawsuit has effected this in the slightest, and that coming from an outside observer.
You are also mislead on that process of law. The judge does not “have to look in favor of the plaintiff”. That is rubbish. It is actually the plaintiffs burden of proof to prove that the defendants did what they are accused of. That is how the justice system works in our country…the burden of proof is always on the plaintiff…or do the words “innocent until proven guilty” not matter?
Also, there have been numerous other “precogs” preventing horrible events in print, comics, movies, and many other forms of media. Some have done it by saying what they saw, some are little kids who draw pictures with crayon and marker, some speak in a trance, Issac’s eyes milked over and he painted. Why do you insist that they haven’t been out there?
Also, the Twins do not have a monopoly on claiming this ability in real life:
http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=3287
Did you know that X-Men had a character that drew the future? In like the 80’s. Did you also know that there was also an X-Men comic #189 in January 1984 that eerily predicts the events of 9/11?
Find it here: http://tenser.typepad.com/tenser_said_the_tensor/2004/05/uncanny.html
And here: http://forums.comingsoon.net/showthread.php?p=2481565
And also there was a scene drawn on one of the panels of a closeup of eyes over the burning buildings, similar to that same one shown of Atta? How do we know that the Twins did not rip that off? We don’t and suggesting so would be stupid. I am simply saying that suggesting that the world’s two largest buildings in the world’s largest city, that have been attacked before is not a stretch of the imagination, and the iconic disembodied evil eyes superimposed over the destruction have been seen time and time again in all sorts of medium.
See, I cannot help but think that you are a very partisan player in all this yourself. I was at, one point, just a simple watcher of the program, looking for hints at what are to come, and now I find myself trying to prevent this discussion area, from becoming overtaken by someone with an obvious bias, claiming others have a lack of facts, while presenting none of their own, and claiming that a District Judge knowingly violated the law, yet not knowing the law at all…
Personally, if you hate the show and think it is a rip off, great. And if the Twins win their lawsuit, wonderful. And if Heroes gets cancelled, fine. But people who come on to public foums like this, and misinform and misdirect about the law, not to mention anything else get no sympathy from me.
Style:
You are unfortunately, wrong on many different points. 1) The Judge, while providing comments on his/her summary judgement, does not have to “look in favor of the plaintiffs” as part of their civil procedure! That is wrong, wrong, wrong. Rather, it is the plaintiff’s burden of proof to prove the claims that they present to the court. Hence the saying: “Innocent until proven guilty.” To suggest otherwise is not only patently wrong, but to do it in a public forum should always be refuted. So please, stop trying to be a lawyer when you obviously are not just an observer, but a biased individual trying to win over a crowd.
Now, another thing that you are wrong on is that the “precog artist” template has never been used before. How many times have we seen everything from kids coloring their futuristic dreams to even precog grafitti on TV, movies, and comics….it is even in a X-Men character, someone who would paint the future…and there is even an X-Men comic #189 in January 1985 that has a character fortelling the destruction of the World Trade Towers:
http://tenser.typepad.com/tenser_said_the_tensor/2004/05/uncanny.html
Here is a pic of it: http://tenser.typepad.com/tenser_said_the_tensor/images/xmen189.jpg
Notice on the lower left hand side the panel which has the eyes of Amara hovering over the destruction of the Towers (sound familiar, as in the same as the image of Atta’s eyes by the Twins?). Now, if I was so inclined, I could suggest that the Twins stole that image from the comic…but that would be irresponsible. Rather, I would suggest that the idea of the two tallest buildings in the world being destroyed in an attack, as well as the iconic image of disembodied eyes floating of a scene of fear and/or destruction are not original ideas. To suggest ownership over such is silly.
Will the Twins win their lawsuit, honestly, if they do, I hope they get every dollar they deserve, as long as they prove it according to due process.
Is Heroes a unique concept…not really, but what ever really is? That is why the reality shows all get copied over and over…find a successful formula and emulate it. To copy a basic idea is not infringement, it is simply lack of originality.
If Heroes ends up being cancelled, oh well, it is just a show. My life will move on quite nicely thank you. But I will not sit here and let you deceive people with the rules of law, just to prove a thinly veiled bias.
You say that those who oppose you are obviously in league with NBC, yet you do not expose your own reason for bias, which is obvious. Could it be that you are making a documentary?
You say that you are in the industry…could it be as a set designer? Yes, I have seen your posts on lots of sites when I was looking up info on this case, and I must say that your litany of disgust has been amazingly frought with suggestions of bribery, racism, and fraud, yet you never offer one shred of proof to anyone, and just spout words.
You were right about one thing, however: “It doesn’t matter what anyone of us thinks, what matters is what the Appellate will rule.” So lets please let those who do know the law, and who do have all the facts please make the judgement, and lets keep this about the show itself.
If you hate the show, move on, and stop trying to poison the enjoyment of those who do.
I’m confused…
I don’t know who’s the legal authority on this matter… that’s why I’d love to read some articles on this story…
But never the less, thanks for throwing this bit of info out there… On my part, I’ll stay out of the who’s right and who’s wrong… I know too little about what went on behind the scenes… All I know is that the series has fallen victim to some serious lack of imagination…
Stay cool folks…
I have to thank STYLE, for exposing the news of this suit,,, more than the legal issuses, I appreciate this info because its exposed the faults in the storyline.
Everyone seemed to notice the difference in quality after season 1,,, and now it seems we have a possible explanation.
However that may be,,,
Due to the information provided by Realmwalker, I now understand what’s going on here with the trial.
This link, (however boring to read) exposes the case,,, and the Twins are unfortunity “out of luck”.
^
http://www.nylawyer.com/adgifs/decisions/121107cote.pdf
^
It also appears that the Twins, could be forced to cover the legal expenses to NBC,,, (its the Twins that didn’t look before they leaped). I feel bad for them in a way.
Sure it looks like there influence was taken, but considering what I’ve read they have no case. (You can’t copyrite influence)
At this point I don’t see any threat to the show other than possibly bad writting ideas.
Again nothing personal against STYLE, and thanks again for posting that info!
Also thanks to Realmwalker, for the legal point of view.
No need to be confused Ergo, there is only one legal authority, and it is not me, and it is definitely not Style…it is the Southern District of New York Court, and, if the appeal goes through, the New York State Court of Appeals.
Here is the ruling again: http://www.nylawyer.com/adgifs/decisions/121107cote.pdf
The important thing to keep in mind is that the defendants have already been ruled innocent, nine months ago, and unless an appeal is granted, this case is closed.
Yes, I agree, the series has fallen victim of a serious lack of imagination since the end of season one, but I am willing to give this new season some time to develop, as I think that there are some good seeds for plot available if they choose to use them.
But lack of imagination or not, it is still better IMHO than all the stupid “reality” tripe or the nth iteration of the Law and Order template.
I’ve been in the production offices at Heroes (Gower Studios) and I can tell you for sure that X-Men, has a huge influence on the staff there.
The X-Men series, is also one of Tim Krings favorite comics…
I also want to thank everyone, including Style, for their contributions and their viewpoints.
Let us just hope that the Twins still get their audience and the exposure they deserve. Maybe, like Style said, they will get hired on to provide creative assistance…in which case, everyone wins!
Okay, about the show:
Some things that I would like to see:
1) Serious ramifications for “time jumping”. You see Hiro say he is never going into the past again, but can we get the same conviction out of Peter? Or perhaps discover that there is something dangerous or even fatal about doing so?
2) A problem with using Claire, Adam, or Sylar’s blood to regenerate? There should be some major long term effect (losing their ability?) for people using someone else’s blood to come back to life/regenerate. Otherwise there will be no end to anyone. It could be a really simple and unique plotline to have someone lose their abilities(or some other major effect), but be able to live.
3) New minor abilities. Lets see some more abilities that are minor, but useful, be manifested. The big, epic powers are cool, but showing minor powers will make it seem like something is changing in the world, and also lead to some creativity to how the caraters use those abilities. Example: the ability to make something glow, or the ability to determine the chemical makeup of any substance. Both of these abilities could be useful, but not necessarily “strong” and would require a hero/villain to use their brain.
4) Bring the Heroes together. I am geting tired of all he sorylines hat continually try to create tension between the Heroes. After season one, when the events at Kirby Plaza happened, I thought that with everything that went on, everyone would rally around that shared event and begin to work together…instead they spend valuable creativity on how to keep them separate instead of working together.
Finally, they need to keep HRG in the show…I liked what one person said earlier, that he was a man without any abilities able to strike fear into those that do…and PLEASE do not give him an ability!
Thank you Realmwalker and 790 for the PDF link, it makes sense now… I had no clue about just what had happened… but now it does show a lot more info on the actual law suit.
Well… I don’t really have much more to say on the issue… I’m sure it’s going to be taken care of… either in a bad way or in a way that will favor the fans.
But for now, all we can do is focus on season 3 and hope it surprises us and makes us happy again..
At least they’re addressing how terribly the timeline is getting hosed through their meddling.
Vic
Agreed, Vic. Peter’s tampering has, from his perspective and that of his mother, made things worse. If they continue to play on that theme, it could be used to explain why time jumping isn’t used.
If that plays out, time travel could, potentially, fall by the wayside as someone else here has said he’d like to see happen.
Realmwalker, if you want a minor ability, look at the webisodes. Not only a minor ability, but a pathetic rendering. Yes, I’m talking Mr. Python and the Flying Circular Camera. Dudes, having a camera swoop-de-loop around a skinhead guy hugging a “gasp” victim, even with choppy closeups on his elbow and wrist, and even if you add the sound of a balloon stretching–it does NOT convince me that there’s any super powers (or even minor powers) involved.
L-A-M-E.
I think that a great “lesser” ability would be to be able to disrupt the time stream in such a way that anyone who travels it would arrive at their destination without a stitch of clothing!
Maybe that would help the show stop farting around with the whole “Time” thing and concentrate on the now…like season 1.
M.W.L.
Well Ergo it is a mess… To understand this lawsuit you really have to KNOW the copyright laws. and if you know the copyright laws, you KNOW that Realmwalker does not know what he’s talking about.
You’re right Ergo, If the show is taken off the air or canceled look at how many people lose their jobs.
It’s wrong to associate stellar talent like George Takei of Star Trek, Jack Coleman of Dynasty, Hayden, Masi, Milo etc.. to a stolen product. like Heroes. What a waste of talent.
When the truth comes out ,all of those talents should sue Tim Kring and NBC.
Santiago received the worst treatment.
Put your self in his shoes as a talent,
to open a major show on a major network and watch your character not be developed and killed off because of a lawsuit before you could make it to the cover of People magazine as the most sexiest man alive is career suicide!
his agent must be fuming.
Why kill Isaac off and let the power float from one hero to the next, just to fall back into the hands of a African artist that can paint the future?
Is this any way to treat a pioneering character? and I repeat: GIVE ME THE NAME OF THE ACTOR, THE TV SHOW, THE FILM , THE BOOK AND THE DATE OF THE ARTIST THAT COULD PAINT THE FUTURE ON CANVAS BEFORE IT HAPPENS”.
don’t say well there was a show and there’s tons of shows that have this power yuk!yuk!yuk! Give me data. Where is it? In their exhibits in the lawsuit, NBC COULDN’T. Go and look at their exhibits, it’s all there.
The Twins don’t have to look at anyone’s work and copy anything and i’m glad that Realm realize that he would be an absolute moron to suggest so.
I am White and I know that if anyone painted the future first, it was a tribe in Africa and the exhibitions on the Luba tribe at the Met museum proves this fact.
I suggest that you line up all your facts before you post.
and a visit to the Met will show you where Tim’s next story lines for the african artist that can paint the future are coming from.
ANd SORRY for the CAP LOCKS HERE , BUT REALMWALKER DOESN’T HAVE A CLUE AND HE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT HE’S TALKING ABOUT. HE DOES NOT HAVE ALL THE FACTS .
As a lawyer, he’s scary. Lawyers that talk a lot without knowing all the facts are scary.
There’s no reason to feel sorry for The Twins. Feel sorry for Tim Kring, Tim should have looked before he leaped!!
YOU DON’T HAVE ALL THE FACTS PEOPLE.
Read the papers submitted into the Appellate courts on both sides. They’re available online and as a lawyer Realmwalker should have no problems viewing them online and sharing the info with all of us in his next posts.
and while we’re waiting for Realm’s post……. Let’s ponder a few questions:
Was Realmwalker privy to all the meetings between NBC and The Twins?
Do you know that The Twins were in Jeff Zucker’s office on Friday?
What did they talk about Realm?
Why was the Wall Street Journal there?
And the FBI agents were asking those questions for what reason? Do you know why?
You don’t.
you don’t know nothing.
I do and I’m posting to give Screenrant exclusives.
YOU EITHER RESPECT THE EXCLUSIVE OR YOU DON’T. and if you don’t , then what’s the point on you being on this site?
NOW…. for all those that GET these posts, here’s another screenrant exclusive:
The dates open to the public for the lawsuit will be available soon. Let’s see if Realmwalker can get those dates for us.
And FYI: Over 75 of NYC’s top lawyers will be there.
This case is the hottest case in the legal industry right now, The case made the cover of the NY Law journal and a follow up cover story is forth coming.
Now,,, Realm, to fully understand the judge’s decision you must read NBC’s motion to dismiss. Have you read it?
post after you’ve read it. and if you haven’t read it , then why are you spouting mis-information as facts on this site?
Have you see The Letter? Have you read the book? Do you know what’s being said in legal circles about the judge’s decision? Give us the answers to all those questions Realmwalker. A real Realmwalker could.
A few days ago you knew nothing about this lawsuit. Why was the info posted here? Do you know why?
No I’m not working on a documentary. That’s another TwinHead in the movement.
I work in the industry and i’m not a set designer, that’s another TwinHead in the movement. In fact I look at Tim Kring everyday and I don’t like what i see or hear.
I gave you leads to do your own home work,
googling the few names I gave you will not get you all the info you need about this lawsuit.
you need exclusives…. And I got them baby!!
now… make up your mind rantheads, do we move forward or do we stay stuck on stupid?
One last note:
PLEASE do not think I don’t understand your love for the show or the pain that you all are in about the mess the show is in.
But you must understand all of our pain in the movement about watching a writer take a valuable artform that has the ability to impart info that can save lives, turn this artform into a silly cartoonish lame show.
you all must remember some of us traveled from Europe to Hunter College NYC just to see this academic exhibition on these artists work.
There were art dealers, scholars, students, stars etc.. at that show that night and I had never seen anything like The Twins or their artform before.
The next day I went to the Met and saw their family’s work on exhibit and I was blown away.
now…. to see a Latino artist on tv crying that he can only paint the future when he shoots up drugs is racist and heinous.
If a writer respects his fans, he wants his fans to get creative, original writing.
The Twins demonstrated at Hunter College that they can tell these original stories because they’re stories of their lives and tribe.
The Twins do not have to research painting the future, scholars research The Twins painting the future.
SCREENRANT EXCLUSIVE:
Tim Kring and NBC have a MAJOR PROBLEM on their hands with this lawsuit.
SUMMARY JUDGEMENT STANDARD ACCORDING TO THE COPYRIGHT LAWS:
In addressing a motion for summary judgement, the court must view the evidence in the light most favorable to the party against whom summary judgement is sought and must draw all reasonable inferences in (its) favor. Matsubita Elec. Indus co. Ltd v. zenth radio corp., 475 U.S. 574, 587 (1986).
now… to all writers on this site.
be wary of a lawyer that spouts mis-information based on emotions, not facts and then have the gall to insult your intelligence with the statement “But then again I’m not a copyright lawyer”.
anyone reading the judge’s decision know the judge is in serious error, as in violation of civil procedure. error.
these type of judges used to litter the deep south and the pattern continues to this day.
The Twins are black and everyone involved in this suit is white. so we expect the rules to change,
after all, America still has a problem with a black man being president even though his mother is white. We would prefer to vote for the old man Mc Cain that looks like he couldn’t pick up a sandwich because he’s white like us.
for any of us to believe racism is not part of this picture with so much money at stake in this lawsuit would be foolish on our part. Plus at this rate The Twins work pulled a major network out of the mud, can NBC deal with the fact that two Black artists have that much power?
NOTE: before the plaintiffs are able to go forward with an appeal, a lawyer and the county clerk of that court must make the decision if the case has merit to go forward in the appeals process and guess what cowboy? The courts let it go forward.
Now in NYC, most lawyers because of high rents, won’t waste their time on a case with no merit and if the case didn’t have any merit, it would not have cost NBC $100.000.00 to try the case . What were all those hours spent on?
The judge’s decision said Oh Yeah! NBC you’re right!! The Twins are wrong and I’m going to make that decision just based on your word NBC not on any evidence that you’ve submitted to prove otherwise. There will be no jury or discovery for you NBC and I’m going to issue a summary judgement without notice and guess what Twins? case closed, NBC said they didn’t do it Twins and I believe them, and here’s a $100.000.00 bill for saying NBC stole your work.
Yeah……. this lawsuit is going to be really interesting.
Oh my, where shall I begin.
Let me just start by saying that I do not claim to have any “special insider information” or be privy to anything unique in this case. As a matter of fact, I am not even in New York, LA, or any other place that would put me in the unique position of knowing ANY of the people in this case. It is apparent, however, that you Style either do or claim to know all of the particulars in this case. How? Who are you that you are so privy to this information? In whatever way that you are attached to the case, you are evidently VERY biased.
You have characterized the judge as racist (without any proof, evidence, or even case record to back it up), have portrayed the defendants in this case to be theives (even though they have been deemed blameless so far in a court of law), and have refuted any attempt at giving a reasonable legal reason why the lawsuit will not succeed as misinformation (although you have provided nothing to prove that is what I am trying to do). You do all this with offering nothing but supposition and your “insider knowledge” without providing us anything but innuendo and the same slanted, biased, and undocumented opinion you have offered time and time again.
Here is a brief overview of what a summary judgement is:(anyone can look this up to online to know for sure)
A party moving for summary judgment may refer to any evidence that would be admissible if there were to be a trial, such as, depositions, party admissions, documents received during discovery (such as contracts, emails, letters, and certified government documents). (IMPORTANT)Each party may present to the court its view of applicable law by submitting a legal memorandum in support of, or in opposition to, the motion.(IMPORTANT) The court may allow for oral argument of the lawyers, generally where the judge wishes to question the lawyers on issues in the case.
Summary judgment is awarded if the undisputed facts