Open Discussion – August 3, 2012

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sr open discussion Open Discussion   August 3, 2012

As usual – talk about whatever you like as long as it’s related to movies, TV or Screen Rant itself – just remember to play nice. icon smile Open Discussion   August 3, 2012

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  1. Happy Friday everyone! After today, I am on vacation from work and do I need it!!

    One movie that seems to be flying under the radar that looks pretty funny is “Hit and Run” with Bradley Cooper and Kristen Bell. Still a couple weeks out, this looks like something I might actually get my girlfriend to go see with me!!

    • I just started seeing TV spots with the Olympics. Does look interesting but the quality almost looks like a made for TV movie. I’ll wait till I see more before deciding.

      AND HEY! Enjoy your vacation dude.

  2. I find myself only looking forward to Bourne Legacy for the foreseeable future. Hobbit’s excitement might grow as more trailers are released but right now my 2012 movie schedule is pretty much over… Which is sad.

    • so you’re not excited for Expendables 2, Lawless, The Master, Les Miserables, Looper, Argo, Cloud Atlas, Skyfall, Life of Pi, Great Gatsby, or Django Unchained?

      theres a few other i’m also looking forward to but i left them out so the list wouldnt be too long. To me, the year is barely half over

      • Yeah not really excited about any of those. Out of those Skyfall might be the only one I check out in theaters.

        • To be honest I agree with you. Skyfall I will definitely see. And Django Unchained too.
          But the rest are DVD at best. I love The Great Gatsby but have a rule about not watching films with Tobey Maguire

          • I’m not a Gatsby fan either but i’m surprised people are so unenthusiastic about the rest of these. I’ve been waiting for the Les Mis movie and Anderson’s TWBB follow up for years.

            • I think it might be due to this explosive summer blow out of Prometheus, The Avengers, Spider-Man, TDKR. Usually you have films like that, huge events, spread out over time and we got all within the space of two months.

              Some people are still recovering in a way, metaphorically of course, and they might be more interested in some of those other films as the time gets nearer. After the summer rush, I certainly don’t feel like heading out to the cinema all that often.

  3. So who’s of the mind that Skyfall can’t fail because there’s no possible way it could be worse than Quantum? (I did like Quantum the first time I saw it, then after multiple viewings I grew to despise all but a few scenes)

    • hahah ya i agree…plus i really like sam mendez as a director so im really looking forward to it…and the trailer looks great! Skyfall and django are the two big movies left for me this yr.

      • No Hobbit? That is the biggest movie left of the year for me. Although I am also looking forward to Bourne, Expendables and Bond. Middle Earth for the win!

        • The Hobbit is likely the biggest movie for many this year, although not necessarily those currently participating in this discussion…

    • It absolutely has that going for it yes. There’s no way it can be that bad, I think it shows what the difference a decent director (Mendes is clearly a fan of Bond) can do.

      We all await the day when uber Bond fan Mr Chris Nolan hops in the directors chair. because that will be something special.

      • For some reason I wasn’t so sure that Nolan should do a Bond film, but now I’m completely for it.
        Like you said, that would be something truly special and I think, very epic.

    • after going through a bit of bond film binge, i not much of a fan anymore. The movies have cool gadgets and great characters, but most of the plots are unrealistic, cheesy and watered down.

      The new movie looks like a great modern action film and with Mendes at the helm, its sure to be smart too. This could be the turning point for the franchise we were expecting when Craig first took on the role.

  4. For what it’s worth (I’m always late to the party), I thought The Dark Knight Rises was Nolan’s worst movie as writer/director. It is riddled with structure problems throughout and lazy storytelling in a few very important aspects. Also,remember that first trailer of Jim Gordon lying in the hospital bed, talking about how the Batman must come back and it cuts a quick shot of Bane into it? Somehow the Bane in the movie didn’t tally with the lethal of threat suggested in that trailer.

    But I still loved it, because it was very brave in what he attempted and it is so very rare to have a proper trilogy and not one good first movie and two tacked on utterly rubbish sequels (Hello, Neo).

    Roll on The Master. Everything is just a minor distraction until then.

  5. Something just dawned on me today. I realized that in 2 big superhero/blockbuster movies released this summer, the actor that fans were most worried about ended up being arguably the best performances of each film. I’m talking specifically about Mark Ruffalo in The Avengers and Anne Hathaway in The Dark Knight Rises, who IMO, (and I think many people agree with me) were the highlights of the films, or at least one of the highlights.

    I don’t know if this is a common occurrence or just a coincidence. Don’t know if this is limited to comic book movies or blockbusters in general. A possible explanation could be fanboys’s reluctance to stray from the source material and general uneasiness with something that at first glance seems to go against the characters, but idk.

    Does anyone have an explanation for this? And can anyone think of any more examples? (Or you can just say that I’m wrong and this is all a matter of opinion) :)

    • When Ruffalo was first announced I’ll admit I was skeptical, but that changed very quickly… from his interviews I could tell that he has respect for the character. He looked the part (mostly) and he’s shown that he’s a talented actor so for me personally, I’ve been rooting for him for quite some time. Plus, Norton was kinda a $#%^@ about the whole thing after he was fired, so it’s not like I was rooting for him ;)
      Hathaway on the other hand… when she was announced I was more than skeptical lol. I know she’s a good actress but nothing about her reminded me of Catwoman. The looks, the costume, etc. everything just seemed wrong, but like I said in my review, after I saw the film I realized that it was me who was wrong. She was phenomenal in the role.

      Maybe, in the end, the actors who we as fans doubt (and sometimes bash) so much end up being the best (or the very least, very good) because they work harder… They try harder than the other actors because of that pressure that they alone have to bare and that extra effort sometimes shows in the final product I think…

      • Hmm, interesting theory. To me, it seems more likely that the initial negative fan response doesn’t really directly affect the performance, at least not significantly. It might act as some sort of added incentive to the actors to prove people wrong, but pulling off a great role requires more than that, like the acting talent, the script, etc. (Remember Cobb in Inception? Positive emotions trump negative emotions every time.)

        On a side note, regarding Ruffalo’s casting, I wasn’t so up on the movie news when it broke, but I remember hearing tidbits around the web and of course seeing the teaser trailer last year where he has an exchange with Stark. I was mostly confused, and a little bit pissed because I love Ed Norton, but when I read about all the contract situations and falling out with Norton, I decided to give Ruffalo the benefit of the doubt. And he was excellent.

        Regarding Hathaway, ever since she was cast, I had faith in her. This might be because I have (blind?) faith in Chris
        Nolan, but either way, I never really doubted her and I was able to visualize her in the role. And she went far beyond my expectations. Her first scene, where she starts out as the nervous, jumpy waitress, she looked just like her classic role (see: Devil Wears Prada, Princess Diaries, etc.) When that scene first started, I assumed that was her actual character and there would be a turning point where she changes into Catwoman, just like Pfeiffer (not necessarily a bad thing.) But then when Bruce discovered that she stole the diamonds, her eyes got darker, her voice got deeper, and she seductively said “oops”, with that mischievous smile. She blew me away in that scene, and throughout the whole movie.

        And speaking of faith in Chris Nolan, I totally forgot the crown jewel of my theory: Mr Heath Ledger himself!!!

  6. Here is something I’ve been thinking about:

    The Dark Knight Rises “echoes” The Avengers. Especially the big finale at the end.

    Climax at the end of TDKR the POV jumps between the ensemble cast of heroes while they fight to save Gotham City. Batman, Catwoman, John Blake (Robin) and Commissioner Gordon.

    Climax at the end of Avengers the POV jumps between the ensemble cast of heroes while they fight to save New York City. Ironman, Thor, Hulk, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Captain America.

    A nuclear bomb is going to destroy Gotham but Batman sacrifices himself at the last minute to save the city. Batman appears briefly to be dead, but survives.

    A nuclear bomb is going to destroy New York but Ironman sacrifices himself at the last minute to save the city. Ironman appears briefly to be dead, but survives.

    Final scene of TDKR, we see Batman, Catwoman and Alfred eating in a restaurant. Nobody says anything.

    Final scene of The Avengers (post credits), we see The Avengers eating in a restaurant. Nobody says anything.

    • Whoa… Creepy…. :)

      • haha thats weird. I actually just saw TDKR last night and really liked it. not sure which of the three i like more though. ill have to wait for it on dvd and then watch them back to back to see which one i thought was the best but they were all really good. I wish nolan would make a fourth but i understand why he doesnt want to. A nice fitting end to the trilogy.

    • Never thought about it but you’re right. Coincidence? I think not! :-D

    • … you just blew the lid of this $h!t ;)
      Haha, that’s an awesome summary dude, but it’s probably just a coincidence. These movies were written/produced during more or less the same time so I doubt there was any sneakiness going on or something…

      The New52 Justice League story also had a lot of similarities to ‘Marvel’s The Avengers’, but they were also being “conceived” during more or less the same time.

      I think it’s just weird coincidences…

      • The Avengers was Alfred’s other dream.
        Hence the similarities.

        • Now compare these two female superheroes. Black Widow & Catwoman.

          A lot of similarities in their fallen women character arcs, their costumes, combat styles, the passive/aggressive manipulation skills, AND that whole espionage trick of pretending to be someone you are not to trick people.

          Then think about the sarcastic relationship between BW and Ironman…. especially in Ironman 2., and compare it to the similar dynamic between Catwoman and Batman from TDKR.

          Is this coincidence? OR just a hot female superhero archetype cliché coming up in both movies, carefully crafted to satisfy the comic geek libido?

          Many similarities.

          Chronologically in the comics, Catwoman was created by DC before Marvel’s Black Widow. But I think they weren’t as similar as the two recent blockbuster movies portrayed them.

          • Black Widow’s back story was that she was a baddie in the beginning, then SHIELD/Hawkeye turned her around and she traded her black hat for a white one. This character arc pretty much matches the Marvel comics right? And this is her history before her first appearance in Iron Man 2. Then in The Avengers BW puts her life on the line and fights to save New York. Then eats with the good guys in the post credits scene.

            On the other hand, Catwoman was always a villain in the Batman comics universe. She was a criminal all the way through. But Nolen started CW as a black hat and then converted her to a white hat before the end of TDKR…… CW put her life on the line to save the city. Then eats with the good guys in the final scene.

            Nolen made his own Black Widow out of Catwoman. The character arcs match.

    • Weird. They’re probably just coincidences, but still weird nonetheless. I think your first example is definitely a coincidence, as it’s a pretty general point that’s kinda unavoidable in action movies like this. Your second example is pretty interesting. I had never thought of that. And your third example is a bit of a reach. The only real connection is the fact that people are at an eatery. They’re not all eating together in TDKR and we all know that those scenes had VERY different objectives.

      Still interesting nonetheless.

      • Yes. I agree it COULD be coincidence.

        If so, and if I were Christopher Nolen, watching The Avengers (which I’m sure he did) a few months before his TDKR came out……. I would have been crapping myself. Especially in regards to that nuke the city, superhero sacrifice climax in Avengers.

        I would have been tempted to stop TDKR release and call for a redo. It would have been crazy expensive, but I would have considered it. This was the big finale to Nolen’s masterpiece, The Batman Trilogy. The fact that he didn’t derail the planned release date and change the plot for TDKR is telling.

        It was either too expensive to change it or he just didn’t care….. “Oh the fanboys won’t even notice the parallels in the climax of the two plots.”

        Or maybe he didn’t see The Avengers?

        • Of the two, I just so much more enjoyed the Avengers, although I thought I was going to prefer TDKR. It is a shame when a trilogy does not necessarily end with the best movie of the three…

          • More times than not the 3rd movie isn’t the best. with toy story (imo) and Lord of the rings (so same say) being the exceptions.

        • Catwomen has many times been an ally to batmam that wasn’t purely a Nolan creation. also catwomen ans widows personalities were not the same at all in the film. widow never pkayed

  7. (Spoilers)

    Batman had to die, at least Bruce Waynes Batman had to in TDKR.

    Why ? Half of gotham knows Bruce Wayne is Batman. Catwoman, Gordon, Banes minions since he calls him Mr. Wayne before they fight in front them, Blake, along with many others. All those baddies will be in jail telling everyone hey Bruce Wayne was Batman !

    Thing is he is putting all those orphans he gave his house to in direct harm. Every enemy he’s ever had will want to strike at what Bruce Wayne represented, notably his home. Not the least of which making it extremely difficult for Blake should he decide to follow in Waynes footsteps.

    The last thing is most of the movie they harp on the fact about lying to Gotham about Harvey Dent. Everything their justice is based on is a lie. Bane uses this considerably to point out the false justice.

    In the end though what does Batman do ? He lies to the city.

    He makes it look like he sacrificed himself when he’s really sitting in a cafe in paris with catwoman. What a liar.

    • So, Greg, I guess you are a Joker/Bane fan, as all they did was murder people, instead of just “lie” to them in aspiration of a greater good. But in murdering and pillaging, they weren’t exactly pursuing justice, now, were they?

  8. What if Nolen saw The Avengers, recognized all the similarities, and did some emergency editing in the eleventh hour before TDKR hit the theaters. And that is why TDKR seems so disjointed compared to the other two in the trilogy.

    Maybe the parallels between The Avengers and TDKR was even worse than what we’ve seen?

    • I really don’t find many similarities. many movies have pov in the climax of many people. its been used a lot in movies. not to mention the characters and stories are presented differently

      • I think saying Nolan copied the avengers which I feel like your saying isn’t right. I’ve noticed at its most bland state it has similarities. but characters emotions and motives are far different cause each character is different. Wayne isn’t ironman and widow isn’t catwomen. for sure Blake isn’t like Hawkeye

        • Not copied. There are definite differences. The antagonists of the films are completely different. Especially when comparing the motivations of the two evil masterminds, Loki and the Miranda Tate/Talia al Ghul character. Also no matching Thor or Hulk in TDKR.

          BUT there ARE similarities. You can’t ignore the parallels between the climaxes of the two films. That’s what caused me to start comparing elements of these movies. Both are in the blockbuster superhero genre and both coming out very close together. Summer of 2012. You can’t avoid the comparison. Here it is again:

          The Avengers climax.
          A nuclear bomb is going to destroy New York but Ironman sacrifices himself at the last minute to save the city. Ironman appears briefly to be dead, but survives.

          The Dark Knight Rises climax.
          A nuclear bomb is going to destroy Gotham but Batman sacrifices himself at the last minute to save the city. Batman appears briefly to be dead, but survives.

          Do you disagree with my assessment? Have I got it wrong?

          • I Will not deny there is similarities presented I’d different ways

    • Nah man.
      There were only about three months difference between the release of The Avengers and the release of The Dark Knight Rises.
      It’s impossible to have made such drastic changes in such a short amount of time. This’ll probably sound rude (and I’m sorry if it does) but I don’t know how else to say it: I think you need to learn a bit more about all the processes that are involved with making a movie. It’s not just editing. In this case they’d have to refine the editing as well, do heavy VFX work which takes a long time (we’re talking about the climactic battle here), re-score certain parts of the movie, possibly reshoot certain scenes, etc.

      Many movies have these similarities that you’re talking about (you can even compare TDKR and Inception and’ll probably come up with even more similarities). It’s just coincidences.

      Plus, and I know I’m gonna sound like a Nolanite but here I go anyway: Christopher Nolan wouldn’t change his art just because of the success of another movie. He’s not that type of guy.

      • @Avenger

        “Christopher Nolan wouldn’t change his art just because of the success of another movie. He’s not that type of guy.”

        Nolan abandoned his Howard Hughes project due to the success of The Aviator. Admittedly, that project wasn’t even in production, while TDKR would have been in post, but it’s still worth noting.

  9. Robin, Nightwing, or a non Bruce Wayne Batman?

    What do people think about the next installment of the franchise?

  10. Just watched:

    1. Star Trek (2009) – A lot of fun! I enjoyed seeing how the crew came together and also the time travel aspect, which is why I enjoyed ST IV so much. Were ST fans upset over the film, or did they embrace it?

    2. Machine Gun Preacher – I thought it was decent, and I enjoyed Butler’s performance. It felt a little rushed, especially with Childers’ conversion to Christianity, but it did open my eyes to the evils of Joseph Kony and the LRA. The film also started a discussion. Is Childers seen as a modern-day warrior for God or a vigilante who condones violence in order to save children? Or both?

    3. Death Wish – The more I watch this film, the more I enjoy watching Bronson as a one-man army (a la the Punisher) standing up to rampant crime in NYC. I’m not happy about a possible remake in the works, but I obviously can’t judge it until I see it. The final scene is one of my all-time favorite movie endings.

  11. Ok here’s what I’ve got so far regarding character matches in The Avengers/The Dark Knight Rises:

    Ironman = Batman (see my above comments about the nuke and sacrifice bit)

    Black Widow = Catwoman (see above)

    Hawkeye = Robin (Both birdy non-superheroes. Both betray their “team.” SHIELD for Hawkeye, and the police force by Blake/Robin. Plus both saved kids on buses in the climax scenes of the two movies.

    Nick Fury = Commissioner Gordon. (Both leaders of their respective forces for good, both tried to stop the bombing of their cities and failed. Requiring the sacrifices of IM and BM.)

    Am I reaching here?

  12. i see no connection between the avengers and batman or any simillarities. then you can put the most fantasy/action movies in one pot,bad vs evil, a nuclear or other world destruction scenario. or all fantasymovies a´la l.o.t.r has a connection to l.o.t.r or star wars. heeeeeehhhh ?