
In the last month or so, there have been rumblings that Batman Begins and The Dark Knight director Chris Nolan might not return to finish off the bat-trilogy many had assumed he would be a part of until the end. Nolan himself has said in the past that it would take one hell of a strong story and excellent script to lure him back to Gotham City after the crowning achievement (and arduous labor) that was The Dark Knight.
David S. Goyer, story writer of Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, has been a little more glib about the progress of Batman 3 (as it’s being called), telling a crowd at Comic-Con that “Bat-musings” were currently in the works.
As writers wrack their brains, and directors question if there is any creative juice left in the tank, and all this drama unfolds before the inevitable and unstoppable release of the next Bat-sequel, I find myself wondering: At this point, is the plot of Batman 3 really that much of a mystery?
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BATMAN BEGINS / BATMAN: YEAR ONE

If viewers haven’t yet put the pieces together, some of the core storylines for Nolan’s Batman films have each found their inspiration in a famous Batman comic book storyline. Much of Batman Begins‘ take on Bruce Wayne’s early attempts to become the caped crusader was inspired by Frank Miller (Sin City, 300) and David Mazzucchelli’s “Year One” storyline, which first appeared in the pages of DC Comics’ Batman series (issues #404-407) in 1987. A re-imagining of Batman’s formative year, “Year One” was so popular that it was later reissued as the graphic novel Batman: Year One, which is still one of the most popular and enduring Batman stories to date.
Besides borrowing the “Bruce Wayne becoming Batman” storyline from Year One, Batman Begins similarly highlighted Carmine Falcone’s reign as crime-king of Gotham; Batman and (then) Lt. Gordon’s tenuous initial relationship; Gordon’s struggle to be a good cop in a corrupt department; and of course, the scene where Batman evades police by using a sonic transmitter in his boot to summon an army of bats.
Of course, Batman Begins had to also provide moviegoers with blockbuster thrills like a high speed rooftop chase and a (tacked-on?) third-act showdown with Ra’s al Ghul – but strip these big-budget spectacles away and much of what is left is purely Miller’s Year One. And, IMHO, Nolan’s film was better for the borrowing.
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THE DARK KNIGHT / THE LONG HALLOWEEN

Almost a decade after Frank Miller envisioned The Dark Knight’s early days, Jeph Loeb (Heroes) and artist Tim Sale decided to jump back into the Year One sandbox with a new installment of early Batman called The Long Halloween. Published between 1996 and 1997, The Long Halloween picked up right where Year One left off (starting to get the picture?), as Batman, Commissioner Gordon and a new “golden boy” D.A. known as Harvey Dent tried to eradicate the last remnants of the Falcone crime family. All goes well until a mysterious serial killer known as “Holiday” starts picking off members off the mob on each and every major holiday of the year. Like Year One, The Long Halloween was reissued as a graphic novel and is still one of most popular Batman stories there is.
While the whole “Holiday Killer” plotline might’ve been jettisoned, you surely recognize the Batman / Gordon / Harvey Dent triangle as the underlying basis for The Dark Knight. Other echoes of Long Halloween that made it into Nolan’s bat-sequel: the character of underboss Sal Maroni (Eric Roberts); the notion of “escalation” (i.e., Batman inspiring costumed villains); Harvey Dent maimed into Two-Face as punishment for going after the mob; that (tacked-on?) third act where Two-Face seeks vengeance on Batman and Gordon; and of course, the whole “I believe in Harvey Dent” slogan, which is the chilling (and revealing) final line of The Long Halloween.
Now, before I get lambasted: David S. Goyer and Chris and Jonathan Nolan all did exemplary jobs re-fitting the storylines of Year One and The Long Halloween for two awesome blockbuster films. No doubt, no argument. However, it’s undeniable that a considerable amounts of both Batman Begins and The Dark Knight had been envisioned (tested and proven) long before the filmmakers sat down to hammer out those scripts. The Nolans and Goyer simply recognized good storytelling when they saw it and decided to build on a strong foundation.
So now, we again find ourselves faced with the question: What should Batman 3 be about?
Well, lucky for us all, the answer, as they say, is written:
Continue reading ‘What Should Batman 3 Be About?’




457 Comments
Now, what’s wrong with the Batstorageunit?
Batman is known to do all his best work in the dark, especially while uncovering a criminal’s background, adding new gadgets for his belt, his vehicles etc. Its one of his best quotes of himself sayin in the comics and shows. In TDK is didnt feel the same, felt just like any other normal lab lab people would be workin in.
Dude Its Simple,Heath Ledger Wasnt The Greatest Actor Of All Time,So You Get Some One That Could Just As Good Or If Not Better Than Heath…Picture This Johnny Dep As The New Joker,Dep Is One Of The Greatest Actor’s Of Our Time Everything That He’s Taken On He’s Mastered,So What Makes You Think Johnny Wouldnt Do The Same if He Played Joker,Thats My Pick,Johny Dep As The Joker
i think a serial killer that stays hidden and leaves riddles might be a cool story with the joker locked up and batman must get help from the joker to find this killer. bane would be a nice sub villain or killer croc,but riddler,and joker are musts.the mad hatter would make a really creepy villain as well. i just think that riddler and joker should be next they fit toghether perfect in this nolan film universe,and if riddler is just this serial killer type that would be awesome,the penuguin would be cool just as the new leader of the mob and not some freak of nature like the last film he was in. their are my thoughts.
ohhhhh i dissagree johny would not be the perfect joker. but some one like ben foster would. he was a perfect killer and reminded me of a joker riddler type in the hostage with bruce willus. my pick is Ben Foster.
Comment 434 lol
I was watching king kong on abc but then realized the dark knight was on max. Wow what a difference! Just thought I’d mention it.
@chrisj
speaking of the batcave, he should have a “trophy room” or just have stuff from the villains he’s taken out or taken on displayed in the cave.
And about Punisher, yes, I agree that acting is important, but I didn’t find anything wrong with Ray Stevenson’s acting, so I think between the two Stevenson wins hands down since he has the look, size, and acting chops to boot.
@chris
You’re absolutely right. Ben Foster would make a wonderful Joker. Actually, he might be able to pull it off better than anyone to date. (I personally think Mark Hamill’s Joker is the best I’ve ever seen, but the character can be done so many ways, it’s almost unfair to compare portrayals side by side.)
@Jose
It’s not really a question of whether someone can do the Joker as good as, or better than, Ledger. It’s a fact that it will bother a lot of people as to the question of tastefulness.
I also see a point that Batman’s greatest villain should have a role in what we should only be able to expect to be Batman’s greatest film. However, from a critical standpoint (and remember, this isn’t comics; a very good story in the comics can appear just plain tacky on screen (Daredevil)) how the heck do you top the level of chaos that the Joker brought to TDK, and still make a relevant film, and not just a rehash? Rehashing would work fine for many superhero sequels. Not this one. TDK might not really have been as good as Batman Begins, but it did manage to become an epic movie, whereas BB was just a superhero movie.
@simon
We never really “seen” Mark Hammil’s Joker, just the voice, but I do like his character overall including the voice…
“What a photo op, the city councilman and his wacky pal…” Man I love that exchange in Mask of the Phantasm.
I’ve always really liked the fact that you can’t really tell just how dangerous he was until he just randomly kills someone. It’s too bad the cartoon was limited in what they can show, but Bruce Timm has said that everytime he uses his laughing toxin on someone, that’s actually meant that person will die from it, but it’s never shown beyond the guy laughing out of control since they were not allowed to so it was more implied for those who knew that the toxin was fatal. Younger kids never really understood that.
I’m counting on you chrisj, we can’t let this thread die! lol
@ Ken J
Lol, I can only do so much Ken J. No Promises,lol. I too loved Mark Hamill’s work as the Joker’s voice aswell as his perfect laugh. His laugh was better than any actor on screen had. Not one episode was dull with Hamill’s Joker.I like him in Almost Got’em episode. Two-face: get outta my face clown. Joker: which one? lol other quotes. Joker: i gotta admit lady, you’re harder to kill than a cockroach on steriods,lol. And from Batman Beyond Return of the Joker, Joker: You know kids, alot has changed since your dear old uncle Joker has been away. New Gotham, new rules, even a new Batman. But im rested up and ready to give this old town a wedgie again. lol Joker: after all the batarangs etc, you’re just like a child cryin out for mommy and daddy. It would be funny if it wasnt so pathetic… Oh what the heck, ill laugh anyways. LOL Classic evil Joker for ya.
WOW! What great insight, and what a great story idea! I’m impressed. I think they’d be hard pressed to come up with anything better than that; it works so well! Personally, I think one of the smartest things they’ve done is use comic-book storylines. Many of these truly define who the character is, and far more often than studios like to admit, it’s the case with superheroes. Comic books have some of the most talented writers out there!
Well if it has already worked on one medium, no need to reinvent the wheel and make Galactus a cloud and Silver Surfer get his powers from his board… lol. Sorry, felt like picking on FF…
@Ken J
“I’ve always really liked the fact that you can’t really tell just how dangerous he was until he just randomly kills someone”
Did you see the episode with the Joker’s answering machine? -I admit I had to look this up because it’s been years…
Episode #036 – The Strange Secret of Bruce Wayne
JOKER’S ANSWERING MACHINE: Aha ha ha ha ha! Boy, did you get the wrong number! Leave your name and number at the sound of the shriek.
VOICE ON MACHINE: No, please! Don’t! Aurgh!
F-ing fantastic, and really shows the Joker’s essence in a Y-14 sort of way (or whatever the TV rating was)
@Panda
LOL, that’s pretty funny stuff… I love the Animated Series Joker…
@ Panda
LoL i loved that part too. I also liked it when Two-Face said: Get outta my face clown! Joker: which one? (smiles) Do you remember the episode Almost Got’Em? I loved how Poison Ivy asked how Harvey was doin. Two-Face: Half of me wants to strangle ya. Poison Ivy: What does the other half want? Two-Face: To hit ya with a truck. Poison Ivy: We used to date. Penguin and Joker were like ahh. If DC Comics/WB plan to do what Marvel is doin by havin superheroes excist in the same universe, Id like to ask them to offer Bruce Timm and Co to make live action adaptions of the heroes that would eventually lead to a Justice League film. Like what they with the animated series. I wished JLU had one more season. That last fight between Superman & Darkseid was just as good as Legacy. And it was awesome to see agile Batman was to avoid Darkseid’s omega beams,lol.
I completely agree with bringing back Two-Face. On my first viewing TDK I interpreted the ambiguity of Dent’s death as meaning he would be the next villain. Had Ledger not passed away I would not have been surprised if the next story involved the Joker pulling the strings from Arkham with Dent being the villain on the streets.
@ Panda
what are you guys referring to when talking about episode 36? Tv series? Is it on DVD?
@chrisj
Yah, almost got em was a good episode. I remember those two-face moments too, lol.
Without spoiling it for those who might go back and watch it, Killer Croc’s story was the best…
@M-Cat
We’re talking about Batman TAS from the 90’s. The episode 36 I reference was an example of how the cartoon brought out how sadistic the Joker is without really ’showing’ anything. Brilliant writing.
BTW – I watched BB and TDK last night backt o back, and talking about the escalation and how that will play out in the 3rd movie, Nolan may be painted into a corner. In BB, Gotham is threatened by R’as and the League as they want to purify the city and not swayed by money or power; in TDK the Joker wants to ‘watch the world burn’ as Alfred implies and not swayed by money or power. How can this progress in the 3rd movie and what villain? I have no idea.
Regarding villains, I wouldn’t be opposed to certain villains making cameos like Scarecrow did in TDK. Penguin and Clock King could make criminal cameos without a story arc and don’t really need an origin. Black Mask is still most likely as the main villain
@ Ken J
I loved the ending aswell. I remembered first watching it and thought it was him? lol. In my opinion Batman: TAS’s Joker was kinda both like Jack Nicolson/Heath Ledger’s Jokers rolled into one even though it was Mark Hamill. I wonder how old he was when the first Tim Burton film came out cause he’d had to be young enough for the part. In the Demon’s quest i liked how ticked off when Batman was shoved aside by Ubu. Batman: I think ill call that strike one. Batman: That’s strike two. Batman: And thats three! and crunches Ubu’s fists and knocks him down,lol. I forget what episode it was but loved how he scared Harlee Quinn when yelling at her in the Batmobile. Batman: You don’t do anything, Push anything, or say anything unless i say! GOT IT? Harlee Quinn; yeah. lol I liked how Lex talked to Joker when he said, Lex: lol, what makes you think you can kill Superman when you cant even handle a mere mortal in a halloween costume? Joker: grrr, theres nothin mere about that mortal.
That was the episode where Harley was helping Batman catch Joker. Forgot the name too, but I remember that episode clearly.
Chrisj, Mark Hamill would have been about 38 when Burton’s Batman came out: perfect age really. He’d have been an odd choice at the time, though certainly no odder than Keaton as Bruce Wayne. Nicholson was the obvious option, but the Nicholson of the ’70s up to and including The Shining would have been perfect. By 1989 I thought he was too old and tubby, and arguably had already shot his demonic bolt in The Witches Of Eastwick. I really think Hamill could have pulled off the look as well as the voice. Seeing the old “Skywalker smile” in that context would have been nicely unnerving, and he definitely hadn’t eaten as many pies as Jack at that point!
@ The Big Dentist
I wondered what the film would be like w/ Hamill,lol. I thought so too that Hamill has that smile that would be Joker’s. Still gets me till this day that Luke Skywalker is has been the voice of the Joker In every Bruce Timm animated series. Now i wonder how old Kevin Conroy would be when the Batman film came out.
Conroy would’ve been 33 – exactly Bale’s sort of age! Where’s that time machine when you need it?
@ The Big Dentist
LOL. Thats a good question. Not sure what he’d look like that young as Bruce Wayne. One thing for sure is if he played Batman in the films, whats the chances of him still being the voice of Batman in all the animated series we adored?
That’s true enough, chrisj. It’s six of one and half a dozen of the other, as they say. Ah well…
@ Ken J
Ken J, do you go on Myspace.com? You should take the Which Supervillain are you? quiz on there to see what your matches are. LOL, the top 3 matches for me came in this order. 1. Juggernaut 44% Mr.Freeze 39% The Joker 28% Of-course you have be honest about your answers if you want the truth right? Try it sometime.
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