‘Batman vs. Superman’: WB Producer Reveals Robin & Batman Drones

Published 1 year ago by

Batman vs. Superman Batman Drones and Robin Confirmed Batman vs. Superman: WB Producer Reveals Robin & Batman Drones

The Interwebs continue to sweep-up whatever Batman vs. Superman bits are trickling out of DC/Warner Bros.’ air-tight lockdown around the film, resulting in a whole lot of possibilities, but few confirmed facts.

However, that trend may be changing as of today, which brings much more solid evidence than ever that certain aspects of the film – which  have been the subject of rumor for the last few weeks – could indeed be true. But as tends to be the case, new answers lead to more questions….

A tweet from producer Daniel Alter (HitmanKane & Lynch) has seemingly confirmed the longstanding speculation that Batman will have an estranged sidekick (presumably Dick Grayson) in the sequel. But that’s not all:

Bat-drones, you say?

Ever since this movie’s announcement, we’ve known that director Zack Snyder and writer David S. Goyer would be drawing inspiration from some Batman/Superman comic book storylines – the most notable being Frank Miller’s Dark Knight Returns finale, which saw the two titans go at it. (Snyder even used a quote from that battle to announce the film at the Comic-Con 2013). However, if the scenario Alter referred to is indeed part of the Batman vs. Superman storyline, it seems that the film will be borrowing from some additional sources as well – such as Mark Waid and Alex Ross’s seminal storyline, Kingdom Come.

In that iconic miniseries, we’re given a vision of an alternate future where the original Justice League has (for the most part) retired, due to the rise of a whole new generation of superhumans. Getting to the point: in the story, an elderly Bruce Wayne maintains control of Gotham City using an army of robotic Bat-sentries that he controls from the reclusive confines of his cave (a similar idea was more recently explored in the Batman Incorporated comic book). When superhuman battles begin to cause mass destruction across the globe, Wayne partners with Lex Luthor to form a coalition of non-powered humans to keep “Superman and his ilk” in check.

(See gallery above for Kingdom Come and Batman Incorporated concepts of the Bat-drones and Batman’s exoskeleton armor.)

Interestingly enough, that same storyline saw Wayne eventually don the sort of exoskeletal Batman armor designed for combat against Superman – could that be the costume that Kevin Smith recently gushed over?. Meanwhile in the Kingdom Come continuity, Dick Grayson had broken away from the militant Bruce Wayne and adopted a whole new superhero guise: that of Red Robin.


NEXT PAGE: The Red Robin Theory


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  1. Honestly not the most exciting news for me, yet I remain hopeful.

      • Hasn’t it occurred to you that Nolan might have better things to do than babysit Snyder & Co all his life? Or that he left after seeing how good things are shaping to be, feeling he was no longer needed? Keep in mind we’re only getting mostly rumors at this point. Nolan’s undoubtedly more in the know than any of us.

      • He’s still executive producing the film. I’m betting it was his idea to get Affleck in the first place.

      • I’m not sure if you mean’t that to be a reply, but I completely agree with bfg666 and ColdSc. Nolan isn’t locked into comic book movies for the rest of his life. He does happen to be working on his own movie right now.

  2. ok not only did man of steel suck balls, now this junk…I am boycotting this movie, let’s skip over superman mythos, and go right to a much later yeared plot line. nothing inbetween, just here ya go…horrible, just horrible

    • WB is sooo eager to have their own superhero universe they stuff in as much as they can !
      Terrible ! Want a MoS solo sequel !

    • Man of Steel was pretty terrible. This movie is quickly becoming another “Batman & Robin”.

  3. It will be interesting to see how this all comes together. Dick Grayson, Drones… Superman vs Batman…I can’t wait!

    • Great to see some positivity for a change. +1

      • Indeed. All these so-called fanboys going all C3PO over everything WB/DC are becoming quite tiresome, like that Rob guy just above.

        • Yeah. Seconded.

    • Grayson might have a minor role in the movie if he appears. but i am not saying it isn’t impossible though.

  4. Superman and Batman In the same movie I will be there. The only thing I worry about is the villains. I loved MOS but I’m a diehard Superman fan also so I’m biased.

    Also is it me or did Zod’s armor look alot like Lex Luthor’s armor suit from the comics. I seen that he came out his armor at the Lex Luthor’s construction site also during the fight with Superman.

    • i noticed that too!

      • I thought I was seeing things at first I just noticed Dang that look like Luthor’s armor. Then he took it off at Luthor’s construction site and i was thinking it has to be it. I guess he is gonna take it and paint it and call it his own. If they use it in the sequel.

    • I’m not a Superman fan at all, I’m a Batman fan, but MOS was pretty damn awesome…the coolest Supermans ever been IMO.

      • I agree a Superman movie with some real action finally and the next one is gonna have Batman I cant wait!!!!!

        If there are other heroes in the sequel its because there trying to get to a Justice league ASAP. Im sure they will just be cameos if they are even in it. I wanna see a Justice League in 2017 not 2025.

  5. Snyder No!, just no.

    This is one of the movies which has a lot of rumors… and very varied among them.

  6. I was not expecting this at all, I actually chuckled when I saw the tweet because of how different it is from what I was envisioning the film. Seems interesting, can be amazing but can also be a disaster. I’ll wait until I learn more about it. I also wonder how they’ll handle Robin too, though I have to admit I’m not too thrilled about his inclusion. One thing that I ask for is for Bruce not to be a lazy bum, staying in the batcave lol. I’m hoping Alfred or something controls the robots and Wayne suits up for the better part of the film.

  7. Lol so many negative Nancys in here. We still know next to nothing about the movie, and half of what we do know consists of unsubstantiated rumors. Why don’t we wait for some actual concrete info before passing judgment? And in the meantime let’s not forget we’re getting Superman AND Batman…IN THE SAME FREAKING MOVIE!! How epic is that?!?!

    • It’s weird how so many of them consider themselves ‘fans’ yet they’re so quick to pass judgment O.o.

      • +1 open minds and open hearts people!

        • Open mind ftw all the time!

    • Agreed. I’m more pumped for this than Avengers: Age of Ultron. Why are people complaining, this is a historic event. BATMAN and SUPERMAN on screen together. Be happy for it. We finally get a amazing Superman movie and a sequel with Batman played by a great actor and people still find ways to b*tch about it.

      • ^This.

        Here… let me handle the inevitable retort.

        “Amazing Superman movie?? LOL!!!!! Iron Man 3 made A BILLION and Sucker Punch and Ben Affleck!!!!! TROOLLLLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOLOL!!!!!”

        • HAHAHAHA!!! Awesome. I did enjoy Sucker Punch but thats another argument for another day…

          • Honestly, I was so jacked when I read the tweet.

            Batman doesn’t retire.

            That’s the point of the Kingdom drones – so Bruce can continue to fight “the never ending battle.” I expect though, that the Batbots will just be at first, then we’ll see him triggered back into action after he sees Kal-El’s destruction (he’s not yet Superman in MoS – just look at the movie credits)

            But then I thought – why would Bruce stop physically being involved if he is still able to be Batman? What about his fight with Dick?

            Then it hit me – JASON TODD. What if they reference that one of the Robins died, and that’s why BW ‘retires’ prematurely? Epic opportunity to make a Red Hood movie later on, or at least to show that the Robins aren’t just silly sidekicks.

            But back to BvS-
            The one League story I want to see made more than anything is Kingdom Come. Cmon guys – Superman versus Captain Marvel? Batman ‘collaborating’ with Luthor to take down superhumans (or should I say “metahumans”)? Wonder Woman the warrior starting a Super-Civil War while Superman the boy scout protests that war is bad? Green Lantern essentially giving up his ties to humanity? Why a super-villain prison is a BAD idea??

            If Snyder’s willing to use even a bit of it as source material, I’m all in.
            I hope this is like Dark Knight Falls and Kingdom Come and Lex Luthor: Man of Steel rolled into one.

            Any thoughts anyone?

    • Better yet, why not waiting until they actually see the movie before passing judgment?

    • I 100% agree with your statement. we dont know whats gonna happen or whats gonna go down. all we know is that there will be a football game between GOTHAM U and metropolis u via a video thats online, casting calls for a certain type of female character to possibly play wonder woman or supergirl (monkey wrench thrown)and that baffleck is portraying the gotham knight. still it cool to hear all these little tidbits… rumors or not. still i will pay to see it and if it sucks then i will go home and cry.

  8. I’m a little put-off by some of this. If this is leading up to a Justice League film, Batman should not be old. I guess they took this route because it’s a little too early to be rebooting Batman? It just seems weird to me, but I hope it works out. Movies are much more enjoyable when they surprise the heck out of you.

    • I kind of come away from all of this like Bats is in his late 40s. Didn’t Superman and Batman first meet around when Bats was in his 30s? I kind of thought this was a movie of them meeting for the first time.

    • I agree an “old” Batman is a little odd for a reboot but it could work in the context of building the JL. The way I see it, Bruce will be about to quit, what with him going vicarious in his cave, controlling his bots from a distance. Then comes Superman, whose idealism rubs off on Batsy and gives him a second youth of sorts and the will to start up the League.

      • I think your theory makes sense. I guess I’m just upset because I want to see more of Batman while he’s still relatively young; I’m not afraid of change, but it feels way too soon.

        • We’ve already seen two young Batmen, Burton’s and Nolan’s (I’m not counting the earlier incarnations), the latter not long ago. I’m not eager to have yet another origin story so soon after the last one. This new take can be interesting. Also, it’s not like Affleck is an old fart either, he’s only 41.

          • Actually, Burton’s Batman (Michael Keaton) was pushing 40 in 1989.

            • Really? I haven’t watched the movie in a while, I can’t recall Bruce given a specific age.

              • I meant Michael Keaton was 37-38 when the movie was being filmed and released.

                • That doesn’t mean the character was the same age.

                  • I…guess…not…? But it’s pretty safe to assume he was about the same age as the actor portraying him. Unless you want to just go ahead and make it ambiguous to support your argument.

                    • It was evident in the movie that he was not new at being Batman. I would definitely say that his Batman was mid 30′s and had been doing this for several years.

                    • I’m not making it ambiguous, it’s just that actors don’t necessarily portray characters with the exact same age as their own, especially when they’re between their 30′s to 50′s since it’s the period of life when we tend to stay more or less the same without much change.

                      Oneiros here says it’s evident he was not new at being Batman, but others have said the exact contrary, well at least that he was fairly new. Who’s right, then?

                      Anyway, this debate is pretty far off the point I was originally making, which was: “Origin story? Been there, done that. Movin’ on.”

      • See I was thinking that maybe this is post-Jason Todd.

        That might give some extra depth to the apparent Dick/Bruce brawl, and give Bruce a reason to quit. Dick wants to keep going, Bruce says no, its time to grow up – and decides to stay at home while letting the Batbots do all the work.

        Jason died in the 80s, which was clearly not the beginning or the end of Bruce’s career. It would certainly make him feel ‘tired and weary.’

        • This might be a little too complex for this movie and for the general public to fathom, especially if it’s still supposed to be mainly a Superman film.

          • But is it?
            I feel like MoS was the springboard, but this is now pre-Justice League, establishing the whole universe rather than just Superman’s world. But what do any of us know?

            • I feel this way too, like it isn’t a Superman movie or a Batman movie but rather a DC Universe movie.

              • BvS will be a springboard to the JL movie, yes, but Snyder or Goyer (I don’t remember exactly) said that it will remain primarily a Superman film. Thinking about it, this is probably why Batsy will already be a seasoned vigilante, so as not to waste too much screen time on an origin story.

              • Glad to know I’m not alone!
                I guess I’m just a little tired of it being referred to as the “Man of Steel sequel” or how Batman is taking over a “Superman movie”.

                • Well, it IS the sequel to MoS… having Batman co-star doesn’t make it less true.

                  • Yeah I guess, but it’s not like its “Superman 2″ – Its more like “Events After Alien Guy Shows Up, But Before Kickass Hero Society Forms” and I think it might be more about Batman, but from a Metropolis-citizen’s point of view. That’s why Perry White and Lois will be it, but we haven’t heard about a Commissioner Gordon.

                    I think it will be about Superman reinvigorating Batman somehow.

                    But yeah, it does technically come after MoS.

                    • See my post from 3 days ago, just 4 comments above.

                      You might very well be right about the “reinvigorating Batman” bit, that’s how I feel too.

  9. I can’t help being annoyed by the fact that Superman just arrived and Batman is already semi-retired…

    • I think people who share your vein of thought are being short sighted. We have had 7 batman movies where he ranges from his 20s to mid 30s. Any exploration of his character would be retreading at this point. My favorite dynamic of the Batman/Superman relationship has always been how Bruce schools Clark and makes him look like an idiot, that aspect would be accentuated with the age dynamic… The young idealist vs. the battle hardened veteran. There is also the issue of how to make the DC universe different than Marvel, with the MCU going the route of Ultron, and then Thanos the DCCU could go the route of Kingdom Come/Civil War style storyline and lead up to that as its not in their competitors immediate plans. How many times can Earth be invaded by aliens?!

    • Do you really want another Batman Origin?
      Or would you prefer something like ’89 Batman, where he is established, but only for a little while?

    • I know what you mean Exodus. It won’t be the same dynamic as the comics but because Batman is older, that might indicate that other heroes have also been around for a bit and Superman will the addition that brings them all together. They can still build plenty of historyn together and create a smiliar relationship that they have in the comics: one of initial distrust that grows into mutual respect.

  10. I just watched MoS last night for the first time, and damn, that was pretty good! Some people will give the sequel a chance, some won’t. I’m no fan of Batfleck, but I think if any of this is true, they have a chance of delivering a very good movie. It deserves a chance as a Superman movie, don’t mistake it for a Batman movie.

  11. Ive decided if this is true I dont like it because whilst it can setup justice league just fine, its too far for batman to be and nothing to build on.
    Also I wanted a more generic batman to face supes and be shocked by him and have to adapt to such a foe.

    • That’s what I was hoping for but it sounds like it’s based on when Bats is in his older years and thus skipping a lot of important timelines.

  12. That would certainly be a new take on the dark knight which i am willing to see. Plus let us be honest just putting the dark knight and the man of steel in the same movie is enough to make the whole world sit their behind at the movie theater

  13. I’d rather not see not drones. Simply because it’s not Batman v. Superman, but Drones v. Superman. And as a fan of NightWing i’d prefer him over Red Robin(no disrespect to him) just Grayson becoming NightWing is more known.

    • I think the drones could work if Superman takes them out. Like Batman has been using them to police Gotham, sends them after Supes or he comes after Batman at the request of the government (because nobody is cool with Batbots policing Gotham), and just destroys them all forcing Batman to confront him.

      • Yeah, Supes’ll wipe out the drones in the blink of an eye without even thinking about it. He did cut through buildings like they were thin air in the previous movie, for f*ck’s sake!

    • Well I think the Batbots will only be in place until Bruce decides to wake up from his premature retirement. He might send them against Superman, but unless its a really epic lead in to the actual fight, I don’t see it happening. But at this point who knows? I’m still trying to figure out how comic book movies became so big, and if I’m dreaming or not.

  14. it would be awesome if batman kills superman.

  15. I like the inclusion of some Kingdom Come elements. It was a great story. I think, as long as they don’t take it too far, a militant Batman is exactly the kind of Batman I would like to see fight Superman. Using gorilla tactics, indirect combat, gadgets, drones, everything that he can throw at Superman is the way Batman would fight. It would be similar to the BvS fight in TDKReturns. I think this could be a good thing.

    • Gorilla?

      • Sorry. typo. You know what I meant.

        • Yeah I know. Just thought it was funny.

    • Yeah! TDKReturns + KC for the win!
      Batman, a resourceful but distrusting strategist, trying to destroy a potential super-hazard before ever trusting him!
      Neither can win the fight, but maybe it will end when Batman realizes the potential of trusting other heroes.
      Can’t wait to see what’s next!

    • Yeah well, Bats will need a suit to confront Supes. No way around it.

      • Plot twist, Kryptonite ring!!! Just kidding, I hope they don’t do that.

        • Whatever suit he’ll be wearing, I don’t see Batty holding his own very long against a guy who can raze buildings without the help of some kryptonite. Miller didn’t as well and he was right IMHO. I agree though, a ring would be kinda meh.

          • What about Red-Solar rays? Remove Superman’s powers completely!
            This attempt worked pretty well in Red Son when Luthor paid Russian Batman to take down Communist Superman. Batman even took down Wonder Woman!

            • Not a bad idea but that would require Batman to somehow know precisely the spectrum of kryptonian sunlight. I don’t see that working in the grounded world established by MoS.

    • Bardem as the Joker?

      That is genius! Amazing casting choice. Never considered that.

      • I’d rather give Bardem a bigger role in the “Justice League” universe, not just the Batman one: Vandal Savage

        • I agree with Mark and kza95. It never occurred to me either but thinking about it, it makes perfect sense. The Joker needs Bardem.

    • No way! Stephen Amell is Green Arrow whether big or small screen! Not bad on the Joker though.

  16. we’ve been watching pretty much the same timeline of batmans life since 1989. i’m all for them trying to incorporate something different. this sounds like an interesting way to go. just jump in and lets go! not sure if it will win over the mass audience but at least they are trying to branch out

  17. You People are F***ing ridiculous.

    NOWHERE did anybody from WB mention the name “RED ROBIN”
    NOWHERE did anybody from WB say “Because he has Drones, he won’t do any fighting”
    NOWHERE did anybody from WB say “Superman is going to make a cameo, this is a Batman Movie”
    NOWHERE did anybody from WB say “Wonder Woman (or Flash, or Catwoman, or etc.) will be in this movie”
    NOWHERE did anybody from WB mention Batman Inc or Kingdom Come

    Ya bunch of unimaginative cry babies are complaining about f***ing RUMORS as if they were a leaked script. As if you had an advanced copy of the movie that hasn’t even started filming!
    STOP PRETENDING like you know the plot to this movie and complaining about your own shortcomings. Meaning that the “plot” you “don’t like” only exists in your own head, you have nobody to blame but yourself if it’s lame. Mine is FREAKING EPIC! Maybe the movie will or won’t live up to that, but that’s half the fun. (Unless I get Star Wars Prequeled again that is)

    I will give you an example of how I am sick of 90% of you.

    Before this article: Superman is so strong, how can Batman ever fight him? What a stupid movie!
    After this Article: I want to see Batman directly fight Superman. What a stupid movie!

    THERE IS NO PLEASING YOU PEOPLE. Go jerk each other off on a Marvel movie thread already and, or at least express and intelligent opinion, for or against, that isn’t based on acting like some internet rumor is now canon. I am sick of having to skip over so many trolls so I can attempt to have a conversation with fellow fans (or intelligent detractors) about my #1 most anticipated movie coming in the next two years.

    /Rant. Sorry for the length.

    • As blunt and rude as your comment came off to me, I have to agree with you 100 percent. Warner Bros hasn’t announced one aspect of the film other than Affleck and Batman. The rumors, while coming from trusted sources and can very well be true, do not have very much context put into them. We don’t know one bit of the script. For all we know, these characters fit the story perfectly. I don’t blame people for being skeptical, I mean it IS one of the biggest and most popular duos being put on film. It just baffles me how people who take these rumors and create one of the most ridiculous spins on them and then state the film will be a bomb. It’s nothing new I suppose so I’m slowly getting use to it.

      Anyways on topic, they’ve been writing the script for over a year now I believe, so I’m guessing they have several things set up and ready to push forward. I’m also happy they’re doing something different with this incarnation of the Bat. Sure I have something in my mind that I’d love to see put on film but I’m not going to discount the work Goyer and Snyder are doing because of that. It’s nice to see someone else’s version no matter how different.

      • 100% agreed. We know pretty much nothing. Realistically also, we can’t even trust the small amount of info we DO know with the current trend of pulling the rug out from everyone.

        Haha, For all we know Affleck isn’t actually playing Batman. Maybe he’s playing Jean-Paul Valley’s Bat-Azrael running Gotham with drones (built by lex-corp) like a big brother-like tyrant.

        Bale comes out of second retirement after the drones go rogue (due to there crazy lex corp programming)…

        But he needs a little help from a certain Man of Steel.

        A bad idea perhaps from someone who can’t let go of the past movies? At this juncture, that’s as valid as anything thing else I’ve heard and that’s what’s fun, building the movie in your mind that YOU would like to see.

        • I really can’t let go of the Nolan continuity thing though… Think I might need a little therapy for it.

          • Yes you do! :-)
            I hope your wrong, I loved Nolan’s Batman but disliked Bales, if that makes any sense to you.
            BaleMan without Nolan is like the Beatles without Lennon… or Mcarthy… or Harrison.

            Basically it’d be a movie about Ringo Starr. IMO.

          • You should really let go of it. The Joker was the only good thing about those movies.

            • @Oneiros. Well obviously I don’t feel the same way you do. If I did I wouldn’t have any trouble would I? Sorry you didn’t enjoy them, hopefully the coming version will appeal more to your tastes. I think it’s the greatest trilogy of all time flaws and all. But that’s just me.

              • I say second best trilogy of all time, right after the Lord of the Rings!

                • Well it’s a close thing!

                • They’re not exactly comparable. Also, as much as I love the LOTR movies, they miss out A LOT on the intricacy and subleties of the original story. The Nolan films, though partly based on pre-existing storylines, don’t have this problem. Yet I’m partial to LOTR because the book is quite possibly the greatest work of fiction ever written.

                • Lol! You don’t get out much then! TDKR slapped the face of the Dark Knight with so many things and add in Bane’s sissy voice, Bruce’s old man syndrome, Bats and Bane’s horrible fight and Talia’s pathetic-looking death. That is not a good trilogy! If they would’ve cared about the third film instead spewing it out, it would have been superb.

                  • @wil_stryder. The sheer POWER of your comment changed my mind! You made me realise that I’m a shut-in and that’s why I love the Dark Knight Rises.

                    Now I finally have the courage to leave my house and view other superior trilogy’s such as:

                    The godfather
                    The Matrix
                    Back to the future
                    Mad max
                    Lethal weapon

                    I know for a fact NONE of these had relatively poorly received third entries!

                    • Heh-heh, Mark…

                      Isn’t it cute how wil automatically assumes his is THE valid opinion on what makes a trilogy good?

                      Personally, I found all three films in the DK trilogy to be excellent. In fact, I thought they actually got better as the story progressed. Do I think everyone does (or even CAN) agree with me? Hell, no. Do I even think those people who agree with significant portions of my opinion agree about the WHOLE trilogy? Of course not. I’m perfectly fine with that. Do I necessarily understand WHY they don’t share my opinion? Frequently, no. I, however, always enjoy hearing other perspectives and (as I have said to you before) perhaps even discussing/debating those differences of opinion…as I’ve noticed you and others (DragonArcher comes to mind, most immediately) seem to do…as long as no superiority is implied by either opinion.

                      If only the wil_stryders of the world would adopt that philosophy???sigh. :)

        • geez, I like this idea! ;)

      • Sorry ColdSc. I’ve been trying to play nice with the haters but I lost it a bit today.

        Thought the drones could be a cool idea. Love Batman Inc and Kingdom Come. Thought this could some pretty good news and was looking forward to scrolling down and speculating with Superman and Batman fans… All I found was whining and complaining.

        It’s like NO MATTER what they announce trolls are going to ruin the board and turn what should be a fun way to pass a little time into a frustrating experience, I did kinda lose it. Sorry. It’s not like I think everyone MUST share my opinion, just be constructive in your criticism, for the sake of an interesting conversation, or just leave it alone.

        I agree with wanting to see somebody else’s version. I like when people blow my preconceived ideas out of the water. Kinda like Snyder did with MOS, for me at least. It’s like I said somewhere else on this page, it’s fun to speculate, but don’t get confused, speculation is all it is. And for the love of God people, if you hated the movie, why do you insist on commenting on every article related to its sequel? I hated Iron Man 3, I never comment on an Iron Man article just to s*** on a movie others may have loved.

        • I for one loved both MoS and IM3, the latter largely because of Kingsley and how they reimagined the Mandarin. *raises fanboy shield*

          • I LOVED Kingsley in that movie. “Yooou’ll neverrr seee mee coming.”
            Oh what could have been. Just to be clear, I don’t just dislike what they did with Mandarin because of its affect on IM3.
            Rather, all the great possibilities moving forward. I like Loki, but not really as a villain. I just find him too funny and… well… Like him too much.
            With Kingsley they finally had a GREAT villain in the MCU, and then…

            Why? And why not let Favreau direct. His Iron Man movie is top 3 all time CBM to me. With MOS and The Dark Knight. OK, IM2 wasn’t that great, but IM3 made IM2 look like IM in my, not always all that humble, opinion.

            • I loved Kingsley in the trailers… Trevor Slattery reminded me of Jar Jar Binks and by that stage of the film I was not in a laughing mood.

              IM3 made me appreciate IM2 a lot more. Iron Man is still my favourite Marvel movie and I had high expectations when 2 came out which the film didn’t reach but after several viewings since I can happily say Iron Man 2 is amoung my favourite comic book films. RDJ was great, I like Don Cheadle, I like the triangle chest piece, Stark’s father issues developed, Scarlett Johansson was a great introduction and Sam Rockwell is the f*ing man, plus the drama/humour ratio was about right (Marvel has gone too far towards humour for me and I haven’t enjoyed phase 2 as much as I expected to so far).

              I very very much enjoyed Man of Steel and I can’t wait to see how Snyder and Affleck interperate this new Batman.

              • I agree with you on pretty much every point.
                Mostly the overuse of humor thus far in phase 2. During the latest Thor flick I caught myself thinking “is this supposed to be a comedy?”

                I also think IM2 was better than most people give it credit for, I can’t heap as much praise as you on it. A. Because I didn’t like it quite as much as you seemed to have and B. Marvel fanboys have irritated me to the point I find it hard to give praise in these forums, even though I do enjoy the movies, because I feel I need to help create at least a little balance.

                • Fair enough. I’m still really looking forward to Captain America: The Winter Soldier and Guardians of the Galaxy. Captain was probably the most serious film of phase 1 and I feel that might be the same in phase 2 and I think Chris Pratt is a great comedic actor, and I have no prior knowledge of the Guardians going in so I think I’ll get expected enjoyment from this film if it has a lighter tone. I didn’t really like the mid-credit scene of Thor 2, from what I’ve read on this site the Collector is supposed to be a bit strange, but his character just didn’t appeal to me all that much.

                  • I liked the first half of Captain America. I did not like the Red Skull though, too bad as we all know what a great villain Hugo Weaving can be. That’s nothing new though, if there is one place I’d like to see improvement in the MCU it’s the bad guys. They have still yet to make one I love, and I find the antagonist to be one of the most important parts of a CBM. Mandarin was ALMOST there first IMO. They do heroes great, but I think their lighter tone, thus far, has prevented them from having a really good baddie.

                    I have 0 expectation for GotG, which means I will probably love it.

                    • I for one disagree with you both. Indeed, the first Iron Man remains the best of the 3 but in my eyes IM3 redeemed the saga. IM2, while still enjoyable, was kinda bland despite ScarJo, but its sequel was a rollercoaster ride. The humor, which incidentally was already very present in the previous films, worked and only enhanced the ride, underlining (rather than negating like some said) the drama and action.

                      What’s your problem with humor in Marvel movies anyway? It’s pretty common in the original comics, why shouldn’t it be in the movies? By the way, I really don’t get that “overuse of humor in phase 2″ thing. I’ve seen both Phase 2 movies twice and they didn’t strike me as more comedic than their predecessors. Furthermore, I found Thor 2 somewhat darker than the first movie and its humor worked this time around, contrary to Thor 1 where it was very corny and mostly fell flat.

                      @Logan, dislike the film all you want but Jar Jar Binks, really? Jar Jar was annoying and borderline racist, Slattery was downright hilarious. Also, where did you get the notion that “Captain was probably the most serious film of phase 1?” On the contrary, it was by far the most cheesy. Absolutely nothing felt serious in it, from the script to the acting to the costumes and make-up, to the extent that one could almost expect Adam West to show up. Thankfully, the sequel’s shaping up to be much better.

                      Oh, and @DragonArcher23, Marvel didn’t fire Favreau, it was his decision to step down from the director’s chair in order to direct Magic Kingdom, which ironically is still to be made… If he was forced out, do you really think he would’ve reprised his Happy Hogan role in the film?

                    • Bfg666, I am replying to your comment below because for some reason it has no reply button.

                      I am glad you liked IM3, but we shall just have to agree to disagree for I did not. Why do I think there is too much humor in phase 2? I Admit IM3 wasn’t overdone, save for the fact they turned Iron Man’s arch nemesis into a punch line. For me, that is enough. But c’mon, you didn’t find Thor 2 overdone? You are one of the few I have spoken with who didn’t think there was a ton of comedy in it. Whether they liked the comedy or not. There is one point in the movie, where the only dialogue for several minutes is Loki punch line after punch line. Ok, the Captain America impersonation was pretty damn funny, but it was just too much for me. I know comics have humor in them, but less is more sometimes. My favorite comics are always the ones with a more serious tone with a laugh or two (or three, but not thirty) mixed in.

                      Fair enough about Favreau, I didn’t know that. I just figured it was another case of Marvel playing hardball and pushing people out. See the Terrence Howard article currently on SR to see what I mean. I am now interested to see Magic Kingdom, better be good if he gave up the Iron Man series for it!
                      I will also admit that it was completely lost on me that he was in the movie. Not that I didn’t see him, just that I didn’t put 2 and 2 together and figure out he must still be cool with the people at Marvel.

                    • Yeah, it’s an aspect of the site’s design. After a certain number of replies, you can’t reply to a comment directly and need to go back to the last comment showing a reply button, but when you publish it it ends up in the right place anyway. I guess this is to avoid comments with only one word per line, which aren’t exactly convenient to read and eat up the space like Galactus…

                      I had no love whatsoever for the original Mandarin character and I think what they did was brilliant. IIIII neverrrrr saaaawwww the twissssst cominnnnnng. Granted, Kingsley’s Mandarin was more interesting than Killian as a villain. Then again, Killian, who claimed to be the real Mandarin, was still Iron Man’s most dangerous foe and Kingsley was just as good portraying Slattery (he really cracked me up) as he was portraying the Mandarin. He’s a freakin’ awesome actor whom I’ve been following since Gandhi and he pretty much makes my day whatever role he plays.

                      Indeed, Thor 2 was infused with HUMOR (comedy is a somewhat different notion) in spite – or maybe because? – of the darker tone, but I don’t feel like there was much more of it than in the first movie, or most of the other Marvel films for that matter. Loki was just being good ol’ Loki. Or at least his movie incarnation, the comics version being a way more uptight dude who takes himself much too seriously – just like guess who? That’s right, the Mandarin. The fact that he’s much cooler in the movies (thanks to Hiddleston’s performance) doesn’t bother me one bit, quite the contrary. Furthermore, him being more relaxed this time around made sense since, for once, he was not the enemy. So yes, he joked a bit more and he stole the show in that particular scene, but he was perfectly in character. If you need serious villains, I guess Ultron won’t exactly be a stand-up comedian and neither will Thanos.

                      I probably should mention that I do love all kinds of comics, whether they be superheroics, downright comedy, drama, horror etc… However, my favorite Marvel character is Spidey and he’s hands down one of, if not the most wisecracking guy in the Marvelverse. Second fave is Wolverine who can also be very funny in his own cynical way, so really, humor in the MCU suits me just fine – when it’s actually funny, that is.

                      Magic Kingdom will be a true Disney movie. According to Wiki, the plot goes like this: “A family at Disneyland finds the theme park characters and attractions coming to life.” Sounds a bit odd for Favreau leaving IM3 for this but apparently he’s been a real Disney buff since childhood – and he has 3 kids of his own.

                    • Bfg666, to quote Star Wars “stay on target”
                      We were talking about the humor in phase 2 only.

                    • Actually, Logan first talked about humor in Marvel movies by stating his dislike of the increased humor in Phase 2, which is an implicit comparison to Phase 1, so methinks I’m pretty much on target.

                    • 555
                      Fair enough.
                      I was really just trying to make a funny because I didn’t have much else to say on this one.

                      Time to scroll down and see what you had to say about the Mandarin being a master strategist or a punk…

            • exactly! The villian is one of the most important parts of a story, and the trailers and the first half of IM3 promised such an epic bad guy, only to snatch him away! I felt like a little kid whose lollipop had been smacked to the ground and stomped on.

              Honestly that is my main disappointment with Thor 2(which I really liked) Malekith is underused, which is sad because Christopher Eccleston is an amazing actor who could have done so much more with the character.

              • I have to agree, I found him (the character) very generic and uninteresting.

                I am STILL waiting for a great MCU villain.

                Something up there with the Joker (either version) Zod (I thought he was a very complex villain, one you could almost side with if you looked from his perspective only) Dr. Freeze (JK) or Ra’s Al Ghul.


                • Uh, what about Loki?

                  • Have we come full circle already?

                    I explained why Loki is not a great villain to me the first time I replied to you.
                    He’s just too likable. I don’t find him sinister or intimidating at all.

                    Also, to step outside the MCU, I’m just a little too well versed in Norse Mythology. Loki was always one of my favorite Gods (when he wasn’t turning himself into a female horse and getting knocked up that is) and I would rather see him as a good guy, or at least a neutral prankster, I know that’s not what he is in the comics, but if you are going to be shockingly unoriginal by making Norse Gods into comic book characters, you at least have to accept that the old world mythology will always supersede your comic book mythology,

                    So yeah, No, Marvel still has 0 good villains IMO. Unless we want to flip over to another studio making Marvel movies and talk about either version of Magneto.

                    • He may not be sinister or intimidating but that’s precisely why I think he’s a great villain, regardless of how cool I think he is. He’s a sneaky bastard who gets constantly mocked and/or taken for granted until he backstabs you. To quote another villain, you’ll never see him coming. That’s how he now sits on Odin’s throne and has repeatedly caused the most trouble so far. Not bad, I say.

                      Also, you have to keep things separated. Just like the MCU isn’t a carbon copy of the comics universe, he’s not the Loki from the real world’s mythology and you shouldn’t transfer your feelings for the “real” Loki to Marvel’s version of the character.

                    • Fair enough.
                      Bottom line, you like him as a villain, I do not.

            • And then what? Apparently, they’re not done with Kingsley yet and since the news broke of his involvement in a future One-Shot, people have been raving about the possibility of a double deception, Slattery being only a ploy and Kingsley effectively being the true Mandarin all along. At first I wasn’t really thrilled at the idea because it would’ve meant that Marvel gave in and didn’t have the balls to hold their ground against fan pressure, but the more I think about it the more I’m warming up to it because yes, Kingsley as the Mandarin just rocked all kinds of awesome!

              That said, if he doesn’t come back as the Mandarin, I’ll still be content with Slattery’s deception and Killian being the true Mandarin. That was beyond unexpected and it made me have a huge respect for Marvel for that ballsy move of altering this most ridiculous (in the comics) villain in such a drastic way.

              • If they are raving about that possibility, they are fools IMO.
                Just seems like it would be a cop out because of the negative reaction.
                And I still will never be able to take the character as seriously as I was before the “twist.”
                They altered the character enough just by what Kingsley had done with it up to that point. What you think is ballsy I think was a twist just for the sake of a twist, which is lazy and way too M Night Shamalamalakem for me. What gave you respect for Marvel knocked them down a peg or two for me.

                It’ll be even WORSE if they bring him back for a double deception. So basically he’s a coward? Once an actual fight came to him he sold himself out and pretended to be a jack azz so he wouldn’t get beat up? He is supposed to ever again be terrifying after he soiled his britches like that?

                That actually sounds like a good idea to you?

                • Yes, it does look like a cop out but honestly, the disappointment of Marvel giving in does pale in comparison to the prospect of seeing Kingsley return as the Mandarin, so really, whatever. And it doesn’t necessarily make him a coward. If Marvel’s plan is indeed the double deception, it means that the Mandarin being a whimpering actor was only an act and that he’s in fact just as devious as ever. Ever heard of strategy? Sometimes retreating only to strike back harder can be a good idea, yeah. Seriously pal, in the comics the villains ALWAYS do that! It’d be pretty cool if Marvel gave us recurring villains other than Loki if you ask me, and who’s more suited to come back for a second round against Stark than the Mandarin? The Marvel execs have gone on record saying that they’d like to make at least one or two more Iron Man movies, so there. And maybe in the meantime he could somehow find a way to power his rings (thanks to Thanos and the Infinity Gauntlet perhaps?) and become the full-fledged Mandarin the fans were expecting…

                  • I like talking to you, I do.
                    So please don’t call me “pal” again or I will have to start ignoring you. If I remember correct, you are French. Maybe it’s different there, I’ll give that benefit of the doubt, but where I’m from calling somebody who isn’t a friend “friend” is insulting. Or pal, buddy, chief, etc.

                    Back on topic:
                    This is once again an agree to disagree scenario.

                    To me, it’s cowardice, plain and simple. Your enemy stands before you, there is no better time to attack than then. A strategist would know a bird in hand is worth two in the bush. Only reason to retreat until later is if you thought you couldn’t win. Not very terrifying.

                    I would have loved him to have been a reoccurring villain. But they f***ed that up now. That’s my opinion and your not going to change my mind, as I am not going to change yours.

                    • Sorry if you felt insulted, it really wasn’t my intent. In France, the equivalent expression “mon pote” is used to mark a casual attitude towards the interlocutor. It can be twisted if you include it in a sentence destined to taunt an enemy but in a normal discussion, whether between friends or strangers, it conveys nothing more than a sense of casualness. Since we’ve been exchanging interesting points of view for a few days, I thought it appropriate.

                      I may not change your mind but let me try once more: in IM3, the one doing all the damage has been Killian. Now if Killian was not Slattery’s puppet master but Kingsley/Mandarin was really secretly pulling the strings all along, why would he have exposed himself? That would have been stupid, strategically speaking.

                      At this point, Killian was not out of the picture yet and he could very well still gain the upper hand on Stark. Hell, he would’ve succeeded if not for Pepper! But things were running out of control, so Kingsley/Mandarin allowed himself to get exposed as Slattery in order to clear himself of any responsibility and wait for Killian’s victory. And then Killian went down, so now Kingsley/Mandarin will have to shed his Slattery persona and get his hands dirty.

                      Equating this to cowardice is akin to calling cowards each and every military leader in human history. Do you think people like Alexander the Great, Hannibal or Julius Caesar were cowards?

                    • @Speshlk – Maybe he’s not your buddy, friend? ;)

                      Paul Young

                    • Like “community of the ring” I figured it was just a cultural difference. I should have added that it comes off as antagonistic because we are arguing. Don’t read to much into that word, it gets a bad rap, it doesn’t mean what most people think. It’s really a synonym for debate.

                      Back on topic:
                      I still have to disagree with your logic. He wasn’t secretly doing anything, he was the one everybody knew. He was ALREADY exposed. If he wanted to control from he shadows he shouldn’t have put himself in all the videos. At that point Killian WAS out of the picture because NOBODY knew he was involved. If this was some kind of strategy why would he give away his master plan? Why would he reveal what they really needed to do if they wanted to stop the plan?
                      In your last paragraph you ventured into pure ridiculousness. No I would not call Alexander the Great, Hanibal, or Julius Ceasar cowards. But I must have missed the history lesson where anyone of them did anything like this. Lets review: show the world your face as the head of an army. Secretly have somebody else carrying out your very important plans. When confronted by your enemy claim you are not actually in charge, you are in fact a complete nobody, then give away key points of your plan to this enemy. All to protect the fact that you actually are in charge, so you can attack later. After they have foiled your plan. Makes NO SENSE to me. I am guessing any of the people you mentioned would have allowed themselves to be beheaded before claiming they are not the man in charge. Ego is usually a driving force for would be conquerors.

                      I get it man, I would love there to be some logical explanation so Kingsley could come back, he was that good. But they painted themselves into a corner with this one, and there is no smooth exit. THE ONLY way I could see it, is if Killian and his plan actually meant nothing and there was some other, MUCH BIGGER, plan in affect. Either way, slattery was still caught, are you under the impression he WASN’T going to jail forever for the part he played in all this? If so, you don’t know my government very well.

                    • Yes, I know “arguing” doesn’t necessarily mean “fighting.” All good then… pal. ;) Ouch! Not on the head!

                      “If he wanted to control from the shadows he shouldn’t have put himself in all the videos.” You have a point. Maybe an ego trip? I know it sounds far-fetched and convoluted but the inner workings of a murdering psychopath’s mind aren’t always crystal clear.

                      “At that point Killian WAS out of the picture because NOBODY knew he was involved.” Well if Kingsley was pulling the strings, he did.

                      “why would he give away his master plan?” Because like all egomaniacs since Dr. No, he was overconfident and didn’t envision failure – and like I said before, even with the plan revealed, Killian almost succeeded.

                      “All to protect the fact that you actually are in charge, so you can attack later. After they have foiled your plan.” See previous point.

                      “any of the people you mentioned would have allowed themselves to be beheaded before claiming they are not the man in charge.” Maybe but they had a strong sense of honor. If Slattery is indeed a fake ID fabricated to draw suspicion away from his true self, it means Kingsley/Mandarin has no honor whatsoever.

                      “Either way, slattery was still caught, are you under the impression he WASN’T going to jail forever for the part he played in all this?” For what, having an acting job done? I seem to recall Slattery claiming he had no idea this job was linked to real “terrorism.”

                      Anyway, this is all pure conjecture and whatever they choose to do with Slattery, it could be something entirely unrelated to the Mandarin. Or maybe you’re right and they’re gonna have some serious explaining to do in order to land on their feet. Either way, I can’t wait for that Kingsley One-Shot!

        • All good, happens to everyone! While Snyder and co are the professionals here, I think it’s fair to say if they don’t do your (when I say your I mean anyone lol) exact idea of this movie, just do one yourself. Write a comic, story, cheap fan video or animated short, just don’t bash someone for showing their interpretation of the character and something new. I also get kinda confused when people say they hate the first film yet they visit every article about the sequel. I feel like people like to be upset or something lol.

          • I think it also gets into college football mentality. And they have already painted their faces Marvel red.

            They root for Ohio State so they MUST slander anything to do with Michigan.

            Even if Michigan had a player that was Tom Brady, Barry Sanders, and Jerry Rice all rolled into one all they would have to say about him is:

            “He sucks!”

            • Hardcore fanboys usually aren’t the wisest thinkers, whether their god is football or comics or, well, God.

              • Bfg666, you and I have done a bit of back and forth, but I gotta say…

                That is one of the funnier comment I’ve read in a minute. For once I actually LOL’d. You should write for Marvel

                **raises fanboy shield**

                • He he, thanks! ;D

            • hey, wait a moment there. I am a hardcore Ohio State fan, and I DO NOT LIKE THIS ANALOGY! DC as Michigan? BLASPHEMY!!!!!!! ;)

              • Too funny! I was wondering if anybody would call me out on that.
                I am from Michigan, so that’s how I wrote it. Feel free to rearrange it anyway you want though, I’m not really a college football fan. I was going to use Michigan and Michigan State, but I thought that one might be TOO local.

                On the other hand, most people say Marvel is winning (which I don’t get, I didn’t know movies were a sport) so shouldn’t you like the comparison of Ohio State as Marvel?

                • well you see, I like both (though I lean DC because those were the heroes of my childhood) So to compare either to Michigan is cringe-inducing to me. But I will say I have nothing against Michigan as a state, just the college sports (I am a huge CFB fan) :)

                  • Fair enough. I herby change my teams to UCLA and USC. Works just as well, and nobody has to cringe… Until a UCLA or USC fan takes offense I guess. :)

                  • Wait though, I almost missed a chance to ask a good question.
                    If Michigan did have the player I described, what would you have to say about him? Would you be able to praise him, or because he is a rival, would you feel inclined to slander him?

                    Just an honest question.

                    • Personally, I am willing to recognize talent. Case in point: At the beginning of the season I was telling a friend who is a Michigan fan that I thought Devin Gardner was a good QB (though the year he is having certainly isn’t showing it) Plus once a player goes Pro(which I really don’t follow) I think those kinds of rivalries shouldn’t make as much of a difference. But seriously: UM vs OSU is a nasty rivalry (which started with the Toledo War) and a very good example of how out of control Marvel vs DC is getting

                • Marvel’s not winning, they’re simply ahead of DC in terms of building a shared universe.

    • While most of what you said is on the mark, I think your rant goes a bit over the deep end. While I don’t buy for one minute the BvS film will borrow heavily from Kingom Come, I wouldn’t rule out a *few* elements from it. Like the Nolan Batfilms – influenced by varied comics storylines such as Long Halloween, Knightfall, No Man;s Land and Dark Knight Returns. There’s no reason why Synder and Goyer wouldn’t follow such examples. But I don’t think BvS will be a direct adaptation of that storyline. *If it was, the title should be Man Of Steel : Kingdom Come. I wouldn’t mind at all if the new Batsuit was close to that of Kingdom Come. Personally I’d like to see a bit of a Bat-like cape (as seen in Grant Morrison’s Arkham Asylum)

      But c’mon. As annoying as this all is, it is an interesting discussion.
      Do I think it’s all Kingdom Bome? No. Do I think Robin/Nightwing/ Red Robin is in this? No. Do I think Wonder Woman is in this? No. Easter eggs or a tip of the hat maybe, but that’s about it.

      • Umm, I went more than a little over the deep end.
        Sorry, needed to vent.
        But make no mistake, I wasn’t talking to you. You put your ideas/opinions (good or bad) out in a very nice manner. In a type of way that might start an interesting conversation… not an argument. Seems many just want to anger people and pick a fight.

        Now, on to that conversation.
        I love the Arkham Asylum, kinda psychedelic in its art. Which is a style I could see Snyder pulling off. What do you mean by bat-like cape though? All I remember about the cape is the shoulders. Which were cool and kinda creepy. That is what I want most of all, a scary Batman. I loved Batman as a kid (and to this day) because he is a dark, sometimes almost demonic, character. I would love to see that on the big screen. **cough cough** white eyes **cough**
        Yes I know TDKT barrowed from many sources, I expect Snyder/Goyer will do the same here. Which ones? Who knows, but they could do much worse than Kingdom Come or Batman INC.

        • Yes. The pointed shoulders. Just a hint of it at least.

              • I thought Hush was more like black with blue accents, but that might just be me misinterpreting Jim Lee’s use of lighting. Good point though, I didn’t think of the Returns suit. I like the infographic, but I think its too cartoony to be a resource; I would rather just check out Google Images. And I don’t know about you, but I’ve never read a Golden Age book. Those things must be pretty old…

                Like said below, I think we can envision Ben Affleck in the basic Hush suit with some changes, so a classic light blue/gray suit with solid eyes, long ears and a narrower symbol sans oval. I might Photoshop this sometime soon if I have some spare time. I poked around the internet and it seems like Kevin Smith admitted that it was like a Jim Lee design.

                • Yeah, dark blue is often pictured with a lot of black and just a few touches of actual blue (see Spider-Man). The infographic is cartoony but it gives pretty good color reference, if not 100% accurate (the Batman & Robin costume, for instance, has some grey/silvery elements that are missing here). Plus, having all these variations at once on the same page is quite handy. I’ve seen some Golden Age pics but I haven’t actually read any GA comics.

                  To be honest, I’m not too fond of light blue. It makes it harder for Bats to fade in and out of the shadows. If they’re to continue their grounded approach, it’d make more sense for him to have a dark blue or black cape/cowl, especially if he’s been at it for some time: he knows the drill.

                  • Yeah, the light blue is bothering me a bit, (I’m all for Shadowy Ninja-Batman) but I trust Snyder and Co… My guess is they are going to do the whole it-looks-black-but-is-really-blue deal, like you just mentioned, and so in basic picture drawings they showed the blue.

                    Honestly though, the changes to the Super S still bug me – I mean, the S they use looks too much like the S that the older Silver Age Superman uses in Infinite Crisis, and that Superman is a little… crazy.

                    • The S shield has remained more or less the same since the diamond shape was introduced, despite going through countless variations. These variations are only cosmetic details and I think you shouldn’t see too much into the one used in MoS. It looks cool, that’s all that matters.

              • The art is not related to the movie…

                  • *like Hush except:
                    cape is brighter
                    symbol is narrower, more like Arkham games
                    ears are long
                    nose might be long too (kinda weird)
                    and might have spiky things on his knees, like on his gloves

            • Um.. It’s not concept art for the movie man.
              Did you see the vid?

              • The yahoo thing? No, I wanted to watch it live, but didn’t get a chance, and now for some reason I can’t find the full thing online.
                Could you post a link? Thanks man.

                Well, I know everyone here is saying it isn’t concept art, but don’t you think its a weird coincidence that:
                -Two out of three Batmen are in blue (one is monotone for effect)
                -All visible Bat symbols are the same
                -That specific symbol has only been seen recently on a blue Batman in Jim Lee’s Hush costume, which is rumored to be the inspiration of the Batfleck suit

                But yeah, I really am probably seeing way too much into this. Either way, the suits gonna be pretty kickass.

                • You have a point that they are all quite similar though.

                  Does Snyder REALLY have the balls to do blue? We shall see.

                  • Snyder had the balls to quit with the “hey look, I wear glasses so you don’t know who I am” thing and to make Superman kill, so anything is possible.

                  • Thanks for the link! I managed to find the whole thing myself yesterday-I had no idea Kevin Smith was such a big fan! I’m so glad I watched it finally.

                    I’m willing to bet that not only does Snyder have the balls to go blue, but to have solid white eyes as well! So hyped for this!!

                    But while we’re talking MoS, here’s something that confused me:

                    What about the key to the “Scout Ship of Solitude” ?
                    I mean, the crystal was Kal’s only way of turning the thing ‘on’ and talking to Jor-El, but don’t they send it away with his baby ship at the end?

                    I mean, what? Did I miss something, or is there not going to be any more Jor-El and activated Fortress of Solitude? I get the whole modernizing thing, but cmon…


                    • Just bought the Blu-Ray and I thought the same thing. The “key” is most definitely gone. But the scout ship wasn’t completely disintegrated. That is the only way I could see them bringing back Jor-El or the fortress of solitude without doing what Goyer likes to call “writing gymnastics.”

                      Another thought I had, that COMPLETELY slipped my mind when watching the movie the first two times….
                      Dr Emil Hamilton was both Overmind and Ruin in the comics. He also was lost to the phantom zone. Might he return at some point as one of these villains? Might that “key” play into his storyline? Might Faora Ul come back as well down the line?

                    • That seems a little too Superman-specific for Pre-Justice League (what I’m calling it now). Maybe if they returned for a Superman stand alone sometime later? I know Emil only really from Smallville and a few comic references here and there, and same with Faora (with the addition of the older movies). I think they were one-time-use-only characters, so Snyder didn’t worry too much about it.

                      I’m thinking that the Scout Ship of Solitude isn’t going to be featured at all in Pre-JL (the new movie), but we will probably get some awesome classic-but-modern Batcave shots.

                      Hopefully the SS of S will resurface in any later Superman movies – if anything, just as an excuse to bring Russell Crowe back. Maybe it could tie-in Supergirl! (see prequel comic)

  18. Not too crazy about Red Robin. Forget Drake, Todd, and Wayne. Let Nightwing do his thing. Utilitarian Batman is damn near scary and that’s when he’s at his best. I’m wary of the drones though; overdo it and it’s ‘knocking off’ Iron Man. World’s greatest detective is the vibe the should go for IMO. And Lex Luthor needs to be in this.

    Speculation: either Wayne or Luthor create kryptonite. They scavenge the debris from the World Engine and then reverse engineer it. Then they figure out the composition of the particulates it shooting out and synthesize kryptonian alloy. From there it’s just a matter of irradiating it. Kryptonite.

    • I like it.
      I hope they go Night Wing as well if a “robin” is going to be in it.

      You are also correct that the drones need to be done right, not because I care if there is any similarity to Iron Man, just because if done wrong, it could taint the flick.
      That said, if they ARE done right, its a way to intriduce high impact action (one of my favorite parts of MOS) into a movie that rightly shouldnt have any. Unless of course, there is still yet a villain we dont know about!

  19. Another thing, I think many of you are being short sighted.
    Yes this movie needs to entertain in a stand alone capacity, but if there is going to be a DCCU, they better already have an idea of an overall plot in place.

    This movie NEEDS to set both the tone and key plot points moving forward.
    I think its the same reason some people complain about MOS. Because they could not see that the story wasnt wrapped in a pretty little bow on purpose, this movie should be a continuation of key plot points from the previous. While also leaving unfinished business for the next.

    Personally, I like that better than perfectly ended little stories with only a credit scene to hint at future plots.

    • ^This^

      This is an ongoing universe they’re building. After all, people wouldn’t watch The Two Towers without The Community of the Ring and The Return of the King, would they?

      • Community of the ring?
        JK, I knew what you meant. Good point, I would rather see that kind of continuation than one and done with hints of what’s next.
        To each their own of course, but that’s what I would like to see, either from this franchise or any other to be honest.

        • Sorry, Fellowship. Basic translation mix-up. I’m french and we say “communauté” for “fellowship.”

          • I had a feeling it was a translation thing brother, I was just razzing ya a bit. lol

            • :p Yet I should have remembered since I watch foreign movies in their original language. Silly me!

              • Me too, I can’t stand when the audio and visual don’t match up!
                Like old Kung-Fu flicks.

                • Exactly, and I also like to be able to enjoy the full range of the actors’ uh, acting, which is simply impossible with dubbed films.

                  Conversely, I hate when a movie is supposed to take place in a certain location and the actors speak the wrong language, like most american films set abroad. Not every people on Earth speak english, dammit! Neither do Norse gods for that matter… I’m so glad the dark elves had their own language in Thor 2.

                  Another american specialty that makes me cringe is hiring screenwriters and actors who think they can speak whatever language when they clearly don’t, while there are countless right people for whom it’d be a piece of cake. We do notice, people! Case in point: Lost’s Danielle Rousseau – casting a Croatian to play a French in an american show, really JJ? Besides her horribly thick accent, her lines were riddled with grammatical errors that a real french would never make, even after having been castaway for so long. Maybe the guys in Hollywood should take a cue from South-African Neill Blomkamp who casted a Jodie Foster speaking an even better french than usual to the point that she genuinely sounded undistinguishable from an actual French.

                  Uh, sorry. I didn’t mean to turn this reply into a rant but I think I got a little carried away… I just hate when shoddy work that could so easily be done right prevents me from fully enjoying my original language movies.

                  • Gotta love Hollywood. I do hate when two Russians (just an example) are talking amongst themselves in English. Bugs the hell out of me. I have lived in foreign countries for a long time and have no problem reading subtitles, they need to stop treating me like I’m stupid.

                    It really differentiates movies (or tv) when they take the time to not do this. Game of Thrones would be one example.

                    • Or Apocalypto. I so wish these could be the norm rather than exceptions.

                      “They need to stop treating me like I’m stupid.” Heh, good luck with that! Although… I don’t know how it is in the US but here in France, more and more people are gradually getting into subtitled movies.

  20. Ranters are thinking too hard. You’ll probably get a completely different feel of the story once you watch the movie. One thing I learnt is that most people who post about what will happen usually get it wrong. Batman could carry a samurai sword, superman could change his suit to be fashionable, Dick Grainger could be a Lex-slave but we just don’t know enough, do we? Is it so hard to wait?

    • I agree.
      Its fun to speculate.
      But dont take your own idea’s too seriously.

  21. you ppl are hilarious there has been 1 official confirmation and 1000 rumors, yet 80 out of 100 comments are ppl whining or boycotting or being just plain annoying about what? RUMORS?
    we all know that you ppl will be the first ones that buy your tickets 3 months early and sleep outside the theatre for opening night, so stop your whining, because we all know what is really going on in your heads!!

  22. Yes! I’m excited. I loved man of steel! I trust zach snyder ever since watchmen. Yeah the ending wasn’t exactley the same. But it was true. Nolan is NOT the only one who can do batman. Nolan is NOT the be all or end all to the batman mythos and his batman movies were not the best. Batman was not really batman in those films…for godsakes has any one ever read a comic? This movie is not out yet and people juat crap all over it. Ben afleck was GOOD as daredevil but the movie wasn’t that great. I’m giving this a chance…the only bad dc movies are batman and robin…and catwoman. I am glad they are taking batman in the direction of the comics instead of a winey sad batman that gor lucky a couple times. Maybe batman will be a detective. I do wish that they would do a man of steel two but this is shaping up…and if they do justice league kingdom come then I will be happy.

  23. This sounds really cool – Batman as the bad guy! Now that’s a a twist on his story.

    • If they have scenes like the image at the top of the article in the movie it will certainly blow away your candy coloured Avengers. I have faith in Snyder.

      • ^this^

        Minus the Marvel comparison. Just kinda sick of DC vs Marvel, I’m a DC & Marvel kinda guy.

        That said… Avengers are a little candy colored. But I too hope Batman takes on a tone similar to the top pic, plus many other darker (by dark I don’t mean dressed in Black) images of Batman.

  24. I promise you he was joking, Do you think WB would allow such a leak? This foo would get kicked off the team and sued.

  25. God in heaven. The more I read about this movie the more convinced I am it’s gonna suck eggs.

    Why not give Batman Transformers-like armor, too?

    This thing isn’t going to have any sort of meaningful story; it’s just a shameless ploy dreamt up by the marketing geniuses at Warner Bros to get fanboys drooling and claw in some of the revenue that Marvel is currently enjoying with a, frankly, much better developed (albeit uneven) universe.

  26. Nolan Batman vs Snyder Superman? That’s like… Inception’s Cobb vs SP’s Baby. It’ll never work no matter how many drones Bats has. This is the same Batman that was taken out after falling a few storeys off a building. Now put him up against someone who dropped from space level. Even kryptonite wouldn’t make much a difference. I respect the movies but Nolan’s Batman is just sooooo slooowww & his suit is sooooo heavy, his gadgets won’t spare him for a second.

    • Dude, kryptonite can weaken the big guy into a crybaby curled up on the floor. Even Stephen Hawking could beat him in this state! Anyway, in case you haven’t heard, this Batman WON’T be Nolan’s Batman.