Rumor Patrol: ‘Man of Steel’ Sequel to Be Called ‘Batman Vs. Superman’

Published 1 year ago by , Updated September 27th, 2013 at 12:52 pm,

Batman Vs. Superman Rumor Patrol: Man of Steel Sequel to Be Called Batman Vs. Superman

In an attempt to show up Marvel continue to expand DC’s Cinematic Universe, Warner Bros. announced at Comic-Con 2013 that their follow-up to Superman reboot Man of Steel would be a Batman/Superman pair-up - and not the direct sequel to that film many were expecting – and not the headlong rush into a Justice League film many were kind of dreading.

Now, scant days after that announcement, a new rumor is burning through the interwebs: according to DC’s screen story guru David S. Goyer (Christopher Nolan’s collaborator on his Bat-films, and co-writer of Man of Steel), the next film will actually be called Batman Vs. Superman or Superman Vs. Batman rather than Man of Steel 2 or Batman and Superman. 

Goyer spoke during a Superman 75th Anniversary panel at Comic-Con – running at the same time as 20th Century Fox’s panel, which apparently blew so many minds that this news was overshadowed for awhile. Here are Goyer’s words:

“So over in Hall H at the Warner Bros.–I guess most people know now–at the end of the Warner Bros. panel, Zack came out and he brought Harry Lennix, who plays General Swanwick in Man of Steel and we–actually, Harry read a bit from [The Dark Knight Returns] and so the next film we’re making, we’re already in pre-production, comes out in summer of 2015 and it’s–we’re actually not sure whether the title is Superman vs. Batman or Batman vs. Superman but yes, it’s–that rematch, that combination, the two guys onscreen and that’s happening.”

Superman Versus Batman Movie Rumor Patrol: Man of Steel Sequel to Be Called Batman Vs. Superman

Goyer is referring to Lennix’s reading of the following passage from the seminal Frank Miller comic book The Dark Knight Returns, which focused on an older, bitter Batman who is forced to go up against Superman, now a pawn of the American government:

“I want you to remember Clark, in all the years to come. In all your private moments. In all the years to come, my hand at your throat. I want you to remember, the one man who beat you.”

It turns out that Warner Bros. has registered a few domain names which back up Goyer’s information: the studio owns BatmanVsSuperman.com and SupermanVsBatman.com – which ComicBook.com pointed out may have been purchased for possible future comic book tie-in titles – as well as BatmanVsSupermanMovie.com.

They have not registered SupermanVsBatmanMovie.com, which may end up being the best tangible evidence that Batman Vs. Superman may end up being at the very least the working title of the film (it has the best ring to it, anyway).

So this is happening. It’s something our new Superman, Henry Cavill has said he’d like to see, we have that now-famous Easter Egg in Man of Steel - the satellite with a “Wayne Enterprises” logo on it - and Warner Bros. president Jeff Robinov has already teased the possibility of this kind of thing: “What Zack and Chris have done with this film is allow you to really introduce other characters into the same world.”

Batman Superman Movie Logo Worlds Finest Rumor Patrol: Man of Steel Sequel to Be Called Batman Vs. Superman

What story might they tell? Well, we here at ScreenRant have offered our choices, Zack Snyder’s reference to The Dark Knight Returns  hints at the antagonistic nature of the duo’s initial big-screen team-up. This fits in with some of Snyder’s claims that future Superman adventures will have to address some critics’ biggest problem with Man of Steel: the heavy collateral damage left in the wake of the third act chaos.

And frankly, if Warner Bros. wants to establish a cinematic universe with a common enough tone for all its characters to fit into (by 2015?), it will have to convincingly pull off Batman Vs. Superman first. Christopher Nolan and Christian Bale are done with the character, and their trilogy is apparently a separate entity from future DC movie entries (much to the likely confusion of audiences and probable annoyance of studio executives).

Fans will have a rough time adjusting at first, but this might be a blessing, overall. We were going to see a new Batman eventually, and even if they ignored some good ideas for a reboot (like a Batman Beyond movie), re-establishing Batman within this Man of Steel universe will offer a good opportunity to reset the tone for the multiple characters who will need to be introduce, all of whom are quite different from each other.

_____

Batman Vs. Superman (or Superman Vs. Batman) is expected sometime in 2015.

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  1. Why does everyone complain about DC does, but when Marvel does something everyone loves it WTF

    • Not true. This whole Ultron situation. IM2. IM3. Stop trying to start a flame war.

      • He’s right though. Everywhere I look people pee on DC but marvel can do no wrong, or they make up excuses for them.

    • Because even when they misstep, Marvel is MAKING MOVIES. DC is sitting on their hands.

      Iron Man (2008)
      The Incredible Hulk (2008)
      Iron Man 2 (2010)
      Thor (2011)
      Captain America: The First Avenger (2011)
      Marvel’s The Avengers (2012)
      Iron Man 3 (2013)

      Thor: The Dark World (2013)
      Captain America: The Winter Soldier (2014)
      Guardians of the Galaxy (2014)
      Marvel’s The Avengers: Age of Ultron (2015)
      Ant-Man (2015)

      7 in the bank, 5 on the way (more actually, these are just confirmed), and a TV show directly related to the MCU.

      And they have two other studios making movies with their characters in their own universes.

      Lets compare shall we?

      Green Lantern (2011) – Maybe
      Man of Steel (2013)

      Batman Vs. Superman (2015)
      The Flash (2016)
      Justice League (2017)

      Not including Nolan’s Batmans as they are not part of the new DCCU.

      1-2 films finished, three on the way well into the future. And a TV show with nothing to do with the DCCU at large.

      Its a matter of put up or shut up. Marvel is putting up. DC is spinning their wheels.

      • That is why I am in full support that DC and WB are finally doing something and making announcements.

        They waited long enough, and actually knocked it out of the park at Comic-Con, up to the point of overshadowing most of what Marvel revealed.

        If the film turns out to be a failure, the fans should at least be proud they finally attempted to do something.

        • Just a random question, do watch AMC Movie Talk?

          • you*

          • I love that show!
            I think they are smart in presenting their point of view and very balanced.

            • Very true, I just discovered their youtube channel a couple of weeks ago and have been checking their channel frequently since. Nice to come home to a whole half hour talk show about movies lol. Like you said, they have an incredible balanced view on things and I admire them for that.

              On topic, like you said, I’ll still be proud that Snyder and Goyer at least tried since it’s very evident they care about the DC characters, whether it fails or succeeds. Same case with The Wolverine, if it fails, it comforts me to know both Hugh Jackman and James Mangold tried.

              • I also discovered them recently, and just like Screenrant, I have enjoyed it enough to return frequently.

                In fact I now only get my movie news and opinions from Screenrant and AMC Movie Talk due to the quality and balanced objectivity. Yet both are unafraid to call it as they see it.

                Yes, Snyder and Goyer are huge fans of the character and get it. While I have some reservation in terms of the writing ability in executing their brilliant ideas- Goyer could use help to balance script and his great ideas, while Snyder has proven himself stronger as a visual storyteller in the directors chair rather on paper- they have strong foundations and love for the material which is why I loved Man of Steel despite some indeed flaws.

                I am also looking forward to the Wolverine more than I thought I would. The enthusiasm that the director and actor have his incredible. Every new shot comforts me because they both wanted to take the character to his basic essence and challenge themselves to redeem the character on screen. Their approach is admirable and has got me excited about the film just as I began to worry that the Wolverine as a character (not Hugh Jackman who I think is always brilliant) may be dying on screen metaphorically.

                • Well said. I agree about Snyder, Goyer and MoS.

                • As do I, Screen Rant and AMC Movie Talk are the places to go for movie news, I also go to a reviewer JeremyJahn on youtube, very fair and gives his honest opinion.

                  I think the story will be very well done in the sequel, same with Man of Steel but the script was very choppy at points, something Goyer needs a lot of help in. I was hoping Jonathan Nolan would help with this since he’s a master at screenplays. They indeed have strong foundations but they’re just missing that one piece of the puzzle.

                  • I swear you are in my head. I also listen occasionally to Jeremy Jahns. lol

                    Yes, some small details is what kept Man of Steel from being close to perfect as it could have been. I agree with the some choppy editing. Some scenes looked as if they were longer and cut short way too soon and some scenes toward the end could have been added to address all the themes and close up loose ends while leading to a sequel rather than just dropping everything to the sequel.

                    That is why I was wondering if they would hire another screenwriter. Jonathan Nolan is a solid choice, especially if its reworking concepts. Plus Snyder will still be in the director chair to make it work as before.

                    • Exactly my thought, I think Man of Steel could’ve been on par with The Dark Knight if not for those little flaws. All in all it was still great, just needed a bit more revision from a different screenwriter. Looking at the press release, it look as if it’s going to be only Goyer but you never know. Like you said, they can have someone do a bit of tweaking in some areas of the script.

                      I was a bit hesitant with Snyder in the director’s chair but he clearly showed he has more than what it takes with Man of Steel. Really excited to see what he has in store for Batman.

                    • Its all about shmoes knows you guys best reviewers on youtube then jeremyjahns

          • To answer a potential follow up question.
            Yes, I got what I said from the show, but agree with it entirely.

            I have had that thought when it was first announced and it was crushing Marvel news, but they knew how to articulate it.

            • Agreed with everything they said as well.

          • Hey, I love that show!

        • Very well said Archer. I completely agree.
          DC is finally getting things going! Fans should show some more support!

        • I can guarantee no fan will be proud if it fails :)

          • I agree.
            I am speaking right now as of this moment, people should respect that DC or furthermore WB is doing something at all.

            We do not have a final product to judge yet, but we can be proud to actually get some announcements and confirmation as opposed to rumors, and nothing at all.

            If WB?DC end up not following through with this, its over for them. If it fails, its over.
            They are confident enough to announce at comic con. They have something they are taking a risk on.

            We fans should welcome this just as fans must welcome films like Pacific Rim.

        • You think this is a good announcement??
          I did until about 5 min. ago when I read that STUPID title!
          Batman Vs. Superman YIKES!!!! This will be another GL! Oh sure it will make money! but will it be good??? LMAO I DOUBT IT!!

          THERE IS NO WAY in this Universe Batman could hold Clarks boots! let alone fight him!! did you see what Supes did to Zod?? WTF do you think he would do to Bruce??? NOT EVEN A CHANCE for Batman to hit Supes!!

          I really hope they make it a good film but I HAVE NO CONFIDENCE in this movie AT ALL!

      • You’ve put this nicely. For that, I salute you +1.

      • Why arent you including films like constantine, v for vendetta and red they are dc properties right?

        • But they’re not really part of the DCCU, which I think is what Morrigan was trying to point out.

        • Because then we start throwing in Men in Black, Ghost Rider, Punisher, and Kick Ass on the Marvel side.

          These are all one shot films (and the occasional sequel) that are independent of each other and are not part of the world building arms race that both DC and Marvel are engaged in right now. Same thing with the Nolan Batmans.

          Even with the Marvel head start, DC had ample opportunity to start getting projects off the ground, but they waited for MoS returns to make moves. Which is why what films we do have are way, WAY off in the distance, and they are few.

          I LOVE DC, I just HATE what Warner Bros. is doing with their properties.

          • But none of those films are owned by marvel. I believe the ones i named were atleast all WB. Not sony and fox or paramount

      • So in the end you’re bashing a studio because one studio isn’t making as many movies as the other? Warner Bros are finally starting to show that they have a plan yet you continue to put them down. Yes Warner Bros is a bit late to the party but at least now they’re doing something, if you ain’t supporting, the least you can do is not bash them.

        • It not that DC is late to the party, by the time they get there, the party will be over. Marvel will be in the cosmos by the time while DC is still trying to “ground” characters that have no business being grounded.

          Marvel is moving the chains on this one, and they aren’t going to slow down to let DC catch up. “Starting to show that they have a plan” should of happened a year ago at least.

          Seriously, there are THREE more movies to add to the MCU before we see the next DCCU one. No Wonder Woman… That’s just incredible to me.

      • DC doesn’t have it’s own movie studio like Marvel does. DC is still at the whim of WB. If/When DC gets its own studio and its own head like Marvel does with Kevin Feige (sp?) and Joss Whedon, it would allow for DC to constantly have an entire network of executives doing nothing but planning out movie phases (like Marvel does). Right now, DC is up there in priorities for WB, but it’s not the sole priority. Marvel Studios’ SOLE PRIORITY is overseeign the development and production of the plethora of films you mentioned. To fairly compare the two, you’d have to match the recent DC films with the likes of the X-Men and Spider-Man films. Those are the films Marvel makes at the mercy of a huge studio (Sony). Creatively and business-wise, comparing Avengers to Man of Steel is comparing apples to oranges…

        • Marvel answers to Disney like DC answers to Warners. DC does have an army of executives, writers, pre-production staff, etc to make these movies, they just don’t have the green lights.

          The difference is Disney learned from their Pixar fiascoes that if you trust a talented studio under your control, let them do their thing. Everyone makes money, everyone wins.

          DC Entertainment has none of this autonomy. God I wish they did. Until they do they will be at a major disadvantage to Marvel.

          Also, if the quality of the first two films are any indication, the remaining films will be just as awful if not worse.

          • I agree with everything you said except the last paragraph. What films are you talking about?

          • Green Lantern and Man of Steel.

            • I can see green Lantern. That wasn’t as bad as people made it. It just wasn’t what we wanted to see our of a Hal Jordan film. I disagree with you on man of steel. That was the best cbm so far this year.

  2. I’m so excited and afraid at the same time for this movie. I absolutely love these characters. Both of them. I really like the concept of ‘Hope’ in Superman and ‘Fear’ in Batman. The stories are always next level and mature in way. That’s why I love the stories of DC Comics so much. I just hope they don’t just f*ck things up just because of pressure of Marvel.

    The reason I loves The Dark Knight so much is because it’s so different from all the other superhero franchise like Spider-Man. It involves betrayal, making choices, fear, hope, despair, poor and rich. With an artistic view by Bolan and a killer script. So please, just out of love for these characters, keep it up and make it more than just another superhero movie.

    • Nicely said, exact reason why I enjoy the Man of Steel and The Dark Knight trilogy so much, they aren’t necessarily comic book movies. Man of Steel was an alien invasion flick mixed with coming of age, Batman films are more thrillers than anything else.

      My best bet for Warner Bros and DC is to not get squashed by Marvel’s pressure and ignore it. Go at their own pace but at least have a pace instead of waiting around to see how films do. It’s all about making plans. So far, I’m guessing Man of Steel 2 is the beginning of their plan and they may have a couple of things up their sleeves to announce next year.

    • Very well stated. I think both the Dark Knight films and the Man of Steel offered a very mature look at superheroes exploring what it means to stand for good and the consequences it brings to the world around them. While I enjoy Marvel films, I found the four DC films mentioned to be profoundly deeper and complex. The Dark Knight movies are epic in my opinion while the Man of Steel shows a lot of potential to become an epic franchise. The tone and the seriousness in which DC took the movies distinguishes it from Marvel. If DC created a shared universe out of these movies it would have demonstrably already surpassed Marvel in a number of ways. But sadly it has not and as a result I share your fears. Hopefully level heads will prevail before it is too late.

  3. @Dazz
    +1 everything you said!!!! I love it!

  4. I am so excited since I have heard the news, but some thinking made me a little cautious.

    I was hoping for a Man of Steel 2 prior to something like this, but I am glad that is not rushed out for next year leading to an even more rushed Justice League in 2015. After much thinking, this looks like the obvious direction to go, in a budding universe.

    How can Man of Steel present a final act that is also a global event without gaining attention from individuals such as Lex Luthor and Batman?

    However, the film needs to be approached not as a massive crossover of two iconic figure- is inherently that already- but as a natural and organic continuation of the story of Man of Steel.

    This is why I am not truly believing or supporting the suggested titles above. The film should continually flesh out and build up Kal-El in his new Superman persona by providing a character within that universe that will serve as a contrast and representative the best Humanity has to offer: The Batman.

    This is an interesting way of further developing Kal-El as the first Super Hero but also introducing and developing the Batman/Bruce Wayne character that exists in this cohesive universe.

    The Batman should not be used as a role to try and gain some critical and financial benefit of any way. I would not bet against this being WB’s strategy in making their Superman perhaps more successful then it was in Man of Steel, but this shouldn’t be the viewpoint of the filmmakers.

    Snyder introduced the film as “another Superman film” searching for a character to tell the story he wished to tell. Superman should remain the sole protagonist while Batman surely plays a major supporting role. This makes the Batman effective and believable as Superman continues his hero’s journey. This is not to say Batman should not have his own arc but it should not overshadow Superman’s new growing mythology.

    It would also work in building on Batman being a believable ally to Superman and other would be super heroes in this new cinematic universe by introducing character directly rather than separately. Lex Luthor is the perfect foil to both Batman and Superman and thus highly ideal as the film’s main antagonist. Although character’s such Parasite, Metallo, or Brainiac could be the larger, more physical adversary.

    The phrase from “The Dark Knight Returns” brings some question up just as these suggested titles. Snyder confirmed that he is not directly adapting the book but rather using it as the basis for surely the initial meeting between the two comic book titans. However the context of the phrase brings up questions.

    Batman in my opinion should not defeat Superman in any big way, but merely present the idea that Batman can at least stand or survive on his own when facing Superman. This again will be a huge challenge to depict Batman as a worthy member of a future Justice League, while keeping the character’s essence believable and grounded. Batman should be somewhat at odds and cautious of Superman, but directly against him. That should be the role of Lex Luthor. This should lay the template of ‘Tower of Babels’ Batman which has contingency plans for superhumans beings like Superman.

    I also I am worried how they will depict Superman. “The Dark Knight Returns” is great book in terms of what it did for the genre and specifically Batman, however Miller’s take on Superman is divisive one among fans. Superman should not blindly follow a corrupt, elitist government even if it helps things a little. Superman in his roots and essence tries to preserve the best of government and civilization but ultimately fights for the people and their freedom and safety.

    We see Superman directly standing up against the military by the end of Man of Steel where he takes down a drone/satellite. Superman may be optimistic but not naive or submissive. He will help in his own way. So this confrontation between Batman and Superman must be handled carefully and respectfully in regards of depicting these character’s value and respect for one another if not full agreement in their methods.

    As before the film should make the distinction of being a Man of Steel sequel with Batman appearing as if any other character from the myth due to the fact that this a cohesive cinematic universe, rather than a cross over event film.

    The film will already be a cross-over film in terms of having two iconic characters appear on screen together, but they can still continue the story naturally without rushing it or aiming to be bigger than it is. This is a smart move by DC and WB.

    If this film succeeds, I am betting it can break box office records. If it gets the positive buzz, if it improves on Man of Steel faults and expands what it did right, if it casts the right Batman and depict him well, and overall it is a great film- the film can be huge and compete ever more with The Avengers 2 and Star Wars 7. Maybe even bigger.

    If it fails, no more DC films for the next decade maybe. It will crush WB/DC hopes and prospects.

    I support DC and WB finally taking a big risk and just moving along. Whether if fails or not, we all should be supportive of DC and WB that they are finally taking major initiative without rushing a Justice League film.

    • Very well put and I agree.

  5. Batman wins :p

  6. Tim on point……

  7. Waiting it out. Not gonna act like most of these idiots on here. They have just announced this, so i’m gonna wait and see how it plays out.

  8. Ah, so I assume we will see these two actually fighting each other?!!!! [SQUEALS LIKE TEENAGE GIRL]!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    …eghem, I’m fairly excited by this idea.

    So, if we assume that’s true, then we can also assume this’ll be the story of when/how they met, which means they won’t be “super friends” from the get-go. Hopefully the overarching villain of the story will be big enough to result in these two teaming up. Lex Luthor is the guy most people mention first, and I really want to see that character in this movie, but Superman (or Batman for that matter) can take care of him on his own imo. There needs to be something bigger to get these two to work together, and hopefully, start thinking about forming a TEAM in case a similar (possibly stronger) villain appears in the future….

    [Bane voice] Let the speculation begin!

    • I say add Liam Neeson as Ra’s Al Ghul lol.
      Can you imagine the League of Shadows after the alien to preserve humanity?
      I can.

      Before you tear me apart, I am not saying continue Nolan’s trilogy and bring Bale back. But we can have a reboot of the character with a different approach and actor but we can keep some of the supporting cast can we?
      Neeson would be awesome to play as a full definitive Ra’s.

      • Hehe, I love that you think I would tear you apart for mentioning Liam Neeson’s Ra’s Al Ghul. I guess I do do that sometimes though… :P

        Nah, I think that’s a cool idea, but imo it’s not big enough to call for both these heroes. Batman can take on Ra’s on his own.

        • Personally I think Brainiac would be a big enough choice.
          Lex Luthor in the background.

      • How epic would it be though if they did bring Bale back and did a dark knight returns from superman’s point of view, I don’t really like DC but that film would be mind blowing.

  9. Batman Vs Superman shouldn’t be a MOS (Part 2) titled. It shall be remain it was. Leave MAN OF STEEL (Part 2) out of it.

  10. Very disappointed by this announcement. They’re jumping the shark on the second movie. Besides, TDR was awesome b/c Batman and Superman had an entire lifetime to establish history together. Of course it remains to be seen what they’ll do with it, but this isn’t the direction I’d hoped for.

    • Agreed.

      WB is suffering from self-esteem issues and are now acting like children by quickly rebooting Batman and having him go against a 100x stronger Superman. How will believe this?

  11. I don’t like the title. While a fight between them would be cool, I don’t want that to be the primary focus of the movie.

  12. Guys, I want to get your feedback on this.
    I do not really think they will delve deep into the origins of Batman in the sequel. Perhaps have him be active by the time the events of Man of Steel take place. Surely they would get somewhat into the story, but not much hopefully.

    So what if this Batman is a loose continuation or shoot off from the Batman in Batman Begins?
    Before you tear me down, I am not suggesting Bale to return etc, but simply use that as the basis of the origin story for this Batman.

    Batman Begins is the quintessential origin story of Batman in cinema. Kofi Outlaw noted the similarities between Man of Steel and Batman Begins on multiple levels- stating them seemingly as companion pieces.
    Batman Begins has the tone, visual, and atmosphere that is the closest to the comic book interpretation of the character and the mythology.

    The new Batman would be a new interpretation of the character but you can just adapt it as an alternative follow up to Begins.
    Again not asking Bale to return or keep the Nolan version, but simply use that film as the basis of his origin.

    (Plus actors like Michael Caine as Alfred and Gary Oldman as Gordon can return just as Judi Dench’s M in Casino Royale)

    • Well there’s no need right now for a full reboot of the character complete with origin story and all, I agree. They may do quick flashes, not even flashbacks, but just quick glimpses of memories. I think everyone can agree that his origin is well known. The important parts have always been the same though his origin in Begins is still not close to the comics. The only thing it really shares is his parents’ murder so, like I said, the important things.

      • I agree.
        No one is expecting a full reboot, nor does anyone want to see his origin again.
        Batman Begins in its execution can be take to multiple reinterpretations in which this case one can show up in Man of Steel. They do not need Bale to return, but can capitalize on some of the supporting cast members who wish to continue in a different direction and approach. Liam Neeson as an immortal Ra’s Al Ghul can return, Michael Cain as Alfred who is willing to return, Gary Oldman as Gordon as well.

        The beauty of Begins also is that due to its non linear story telling there are many gaps that can be re-examined or touched upon. Same with Man of Steel. So if Snyder and Goyer wanted to fill in the blanks to further build their interpretation then they can without having to redo the whole origin.

        • Well, I don’t know that it would really be, or seem to be, a follow up story to Batman Begins unless they directly used or recreated exact scenes from BB. Any Batman story can be assumed to draw on the same basic origins. Bringing back actors from the Nolan films…that cast was great, but I favor moving on.

          • Just an idea to throw around.
            I am not saying it has to be strict follow up, but merely serve the basis for the new Batman Snyder and Goyer want to build.
            Even The Dark Knight did not do a straight follow up but assumed you have seen the previous film and moved in a different direction.

            This film can assume you have seen Begins (maybe even The Dark Knight since it rounds out the first year of Batman) and take it into a different.

            I would move on from Bale and expect a change in supporting cast but I think in terms of marketing and building the character some familiar faces would hype up the film even more and take advantage of some of the actors who could take their roles into new directions and full potential- such as Liam Neeson going all the way with a supernatural Ra’s Al Ghul.

    • I support it 100% and I would add Bale! I believe the general audience wants familiarity and frankly are willing to cut movies slack if they have that. For example Iron Man 2 was horrid but because it was seen as being part of a bigger story with familiar characters that an audience had already grown attached to, they looked past the MANY flaws and the follow up still did well.

      • Familiarity would be wise in terms of marketing.
        Iron Man 2 and The Incredible Hulk and Thor all proved that the character can be continued, even if slightly “fixed”, on screen and fans are willing to roll along with the punches and give the characters a chance at redemption.

        This is similar to the James Bond franchise in which “Casino Royale” loosely rebooted the franchise with a new actor and tone, yet retained M for the sake of familiarity. In fact most James Bone films do this. More recently Skyfall behaves much more of a sequel to Casino Royale then Quantum of Solace does in that role.

        I am not asking for it to be the same Batman post The Dark Knight Rises. In fact I would be against it as I feel Batman Begins and The Dark Knight captured and displayed the essence of the character effectively.

        Would I want Bale to return? I think he was the best Batman and Bruce Wayne to date, and a tough act to follow, but I am ready to move on. Although I do not mind supporting cast members returning including Anne Hathaway and Tom Hardy as long as its not a follow up of TDKR.

    • I liked what they did with The Incredible Hulk. Fans know for a fact it was a full-on reboot, and the opening credit sequence revealed a new origin, but it was still vague enough to not confuse normal movie-goers who may have seen the 2003 Hulk.

      I think they could do that with this movie. It can go full-out with a Batman that’s been active for at least a few months or a year even. Different actor, different origin – not at all related to Nolan’s story, but still vague enough to not confuse people who watched TDK trilogy.

      Everyone knows Batman’s origin now anyways. There’s really no need to tell that story AGAIN.

      But, then again, if you make too many connections to BB, then I think you’ll start to confuse movie-goers because then they’ll be under the impression that this new Batman was the one from BB, but now they don’t know where TDK and TDKR fits in… so there’s a fine line.
      Personally, I think they shouldn’t involve TDK trilogy directly.

      …All’n’all, I think, with Batman, they should be taking serious notes from what the Arkham games did. The first one threw players into a night in the life of Batman. We had no origin, and no backstory, but we all knew what was going on through subtle hints and references. In the sequel, we even saw other characters like Robin and Nightwing. They didn’t have origins or backstories either, but most people (even those that aren’t too familiar with the characters) would still know who they are more or less and their relation to Batman through even one line of dialogue.

      • I just say do what they did in “Batman: Gotham Knight”. Bruce is sitting alone at Wayne Manor, then quick flashbacks of the night his parents died appear on the screen. Maybe even throw in a glimpse of his training and the encounter with the bat that made him decide to become Batman.

        Saves time and doesn’t take anything away from the new Superman.

        • Awesome idea!

        • +1

      • I agree 100%
        It should not be tied in too heavily into it, just use the film’s content from a story point of view to build the new Batman character that Snyder and Goyer want to showcase.

        Definitely, instill the Arkham influence in the film. Perfect balance of fantasy that it needs and the grounded that Nolan had. It would fit perfectly into the world and context of Man of Steel.

        The beautiful thing about Begins though- one can use the film to lead into that kind of direction and not feel out of place as opposed to say The Dark Knight Rises. Plus, the non linear narrative allows Snyder and Goyer to fill in much of the blank and focus on thos pieces and not rely heavily on Batman Begins every detail.

        Also, I think moviegoers in general can be given the benefit of the doubt in something like this. I primarily use the James Bond franchise especially Skyfall being closer to Casino Royale while ignoring Quantum of Solace, along with keeping M while the actor and tone changed.

        The previous Batman series had a change of actors twice and a shift in tone yet still in the same universe and continuity. The X-Men franchise have had major continuity issues and shifting tones with a couple of notable bad films yet people still flock and excited to see the upcoming films.

        You bring up the Incredible Hulk and its perfect. It recons Bruce Banner’s origin within the film yet seamlessly continues off the Ang Lee’s Hulk as if it were a sequel. The Avenger’s Hulk created by Joss Whedon and Mark Ruffalo is the same Banner/Hulk as Edward Norton but has a different tone and approach.

        There are plenty of examples.
        Rebooting the franchise completely will still have people asking where Bale is and why is it different. Continuing the franchise fully will just be a plain bad idea.
        Capitalizing on familiar faces (besides Bale) and some elements, will go a long way in marketing and hyping the film to event films level.
        More than in concept alone, anyways.

      • “Everyone knows Batman’s origin now anyways. There’s really no need to tell that story AGAIN.”

        I think you take for granted the origin story. It helps an audience invest in the character. You mention the Incredible Hulk…that movie did almost exactly what the previous film Hulk did box office wise. Incredible Hulk made only $18 million more than Hulk worldwide but also cost $13 million more to make so it was almost pointless.

        I say incorporate the Dark Knight movies and it eliminates ANY need for flashbacks or more origin stories. That is a big part of my point! Why throw away everything you have established …which by the way …people have come to enjoy and are invested in. That trilogy is more successful financially AND critically than Iron Man’s trilogy and that was WITHOUT the hiked up 3D prices that Iron Man benefited from. I don’t see marvel saying “Gee! Well the trilogy is over. Let’s reboot Iron Man” No other DC property has crossed the $1 billion mark yet this Batman that you are so eager to get rid of did it twice.

        • “Why throw away everything you have established”
          Because that which has been established doesn’t fit the tone of what they have going forward. It seems the writers and producers (namely Goyer, Nolan and Snyder) agree seeing as they’re rebooting Batman. They aren’t throwing it away either. It’s still there. It’ll never go away because it’s one of the greatest movie trilogies of all time for crying out loud.

          And as I’ve said more times than I care to count: TDK trilogy had a very clear beginning, middle and end. As a comic book fan, a small part of me doesn’t want that to be the case, but the other part of me welcomes a new version, because the TDK trilogy had so many restrictions because of its grounded/realistic nature (you can, for instance, never bring in Killer Croc, or have Joker be a villain again in the Nolanverse). As a movie fan I can also see that Nolan had an overarching story he wanted to tell with these three movies. He’s done that though (very well I might add), and now it’s over. Continuing it would undermine that story in many ways imo.

          Think of it as The Dark Knight Returns graphic novel. It’s a terrific piece of literature/art, but it isn’t part of the DC Universe canon because the story doesn’t fit with that whole world they created. It’s a stand-alone piece, just like TDK trilogy is a standalone piece.

          As to the Hulk: I mentioned it because of the way they handled the origin. That is all. Box office has nothing to do with it and besides, there are many other factors that influenced that movie under-performing… I can say with certainly it wouldn’t have made much more money if it had been an origin story.

          But to end off on a more comic book-ey note. Le’s say they incorporate Nolan’s trilogy into this new world set up by MOS. Bring back Bale. Now what? We have a Batman in his late 40s, who has long-term injuries and couldn’t even defeat Bane on his own. He’s not a very good detective either. What does he bring to the table? He’s NO match for Superman, and even less so against villains like Darkseid, and by the time a Justice League movie finally comes out, Bale will be even older.
          It just doesn’t work for so many reasons. The makers of these movies realize that.

          I admire fans’ persistence, but there’s no use holding on to this fantasy. It’s just not gonna happen.

          • @ Avenger

            The Dark Knight movie was the blueprint for Man of Steel from the nonlinear style, use of an alternate name in the title to the realistic approach to the movie. They even have the same writers. How in the world could the tone be different? As far as it stands I understand that Killer Croc would seem out of place in the Dark Knight movies but when Zach Snyder was asked if he would have Mr Mytzoplyx in a Superman movie he basically ruled it out because it would be too fantastic. So Killer Croc does NOT fit in the Man of Steel world either

            The end of the Dark Knight trilogy DOES NOT have a clear end. It was puposely left ambiguous. As I have pointed out in an article I wrote the ending of the Dark Knight leaves Wayne EXACTLY in the position he is when Batman Begins starts. He was living abroad, legally declared dead, not in control of Wayne Enterprises and he had left all of his possessions to Alfred who gave it back to him. If it did not stop him from becoming Batman so it would not prevent him from returning.

            If they incorporated the Dark Knight movies he should be in his early 40′s and an experienced elder statemen. The character I saw in those movies was a great detective and he is the one who subdued Bane…by himself when they last fought one on one. As far as him being a match for Superman…so what? They are on THE SAME TEAM. According to your logic Hawkeye, Black Widow, and Nick Fury should not be on the Avengers because they are no match for Thor.

            As far as Bale being too old…he is younger that Karl Urban a popular choice to take his place. He is 9 years younger that Robert Downey Jr who is scheduled to continue playing Iron Man in two more movies. Why could’nt Bale do 3 or 4.

            Finally I write about what Warner Brothers SHOULD do. I have pointed out many times why what they are doing makes no sense. After the terrible history; the constant reboots and the constant scrutiny because Marvel is so much more successful, MORE fans of DC should be advocating for them to put out the best products and continue with the commercial and critical success they have enjoyed…with the Dark Knight movies. Not throw up their hands and say “I will take whatever they give me” and complain about it when it turns out to be crap.

            • I want a fresh rogues gallery that isn’t so weak in comparison to the rest of that universe.

              OOH, Nolan’s Scarecrow (for the 4th time)! I wonder if my gas mask will stop him!

              OOH, Nolan’s Joker! We still aren’t sure why he dropped off the face of the Earth or why the S.W.A.T. tea didn’t pump him full of lead, but he’s back! AND HE’S GOT MORE BOMBS AND KNIVES!

              OOH, Nolan’s Ban- oh, never mind…

              What, does his Penguin fund an umbrella store with the finances he gathers from the Iceberg Lounge because he and his wife met under an umbrella? Does his Clayface smother people in pottery? Does his Killer Moth actually do anything of importance?

              • You know what? You are right!

                What the movie needs is to be MORE COMIC BOOK-ey. I just can’t wait till we see the dreaded Man-Bat (that should really scare the kiddies), then we could have Mr. Toad the mutated frog man. Let’s not forget Batzarro (the Batman version of Bizarro) and the dreadful Mirror Man the criminal who uses mirrors in all his crime…that must really be scary. Then we could move on to Superman and have Mr. Mxyzptlk the midget from another dimension pop up somewhere with his horrifying top hat and then maybe reunite Superman with Krypto the Super Dog.

                Boy! They just don’t make enough movies like that…not since Green Lantern.

  13. I wished Nolan would move on. I don’t wanna see another hockeypad suit Batman again. Id like to see a larger Batman solo franchise in this universe with more characters from the comics not yet seen on film & some that should be done proper as Batman has been within the Bat-Family.

  14. I like what some people are saying about how Batman will be technically “proving his worth” in order to be a founding member of the Justice League by fighting Superman.

    I think it’s going to come down to Batman’s trust being far too uneasy, and that alone will drive him to take down Superman. Bruce probably caught some of the battle of Metropolis on live TV. All of that destruction would make him think Superman isn’t worth taking a risk in terms of trust because if he does lose his cool, he could kill thousands of people.

    Do I think the film will JUST be about that? No, I think that’s just going to form their relationship in order to cooperate as a team to fight any major threats that one can’t do without the other. After that mutual bond, they can add new members in order to create the Justice League.

  15. I cant wait for this movie!!! I’m just wondering who the villains are gonna be? They would have to be major for superman and batman to team up and fight. I doubt if they will have superman and Batman fight the whole movie. They never did that in the comics or animated movies. Plus it would be stupid and not accepted by the audience who’s paying to see it. I think they will need at least 3 villains for this , Lex Luthor and 2 others with Lex being the brains .I’m just happy DC got off their butts and are finally doing something! But i hope they don’t wait to see how this movie does before they decide to make more. Get other writers and directors and start Flash ,GL2 and Wonder Woman.They can do more than 1 movie at a time.

  16. Let me get this straight….Superman who can destroy a building with a single punch, fly fist first into a giant laser battering a hole through the earth, crush metal with his bare hands….yet, he punches Batman who processes no power and simply bust his lip? WOW!!! Hmmmm, must be a shot feature, cause he will need to use that krytonight pretty early. And keep it on throughout the whole movie….lol

    Yep…I can honestly say this is probably the only Marvel/DC inspired movie I had no interest in seeing

    • He beat him in the comics!

      • I know Batman won in the comic’s….but you can’t make it into a 2hr movie, if there really were to fight, Batman would have to use the krytonight before the first blow. While Batman constantly fights hand to hand battle with humans. You never see Superman in hand to hand….unless its a monster, beast, robot or even a God. Surely, if you can lift a tank, stop a train or repel bullets you can probably handle a human(Batman)

    • Deathstroke has said that a punch from Batman is near that of a meta-human. So many people just think the word “human” means it must be inferior to Superman, but Batman trained himself to the peak of physical and mental capability of a human being.

      • See that’s from a non-movie world. In a movie world- its needs to be more realistic.

        • You have Superman in the same movie. It doesn’t have to be anything

      • Mmmmm, I wonder what Deathstroke would say about a punch from Superman?

      • Mmmmm, What would Deathstroke say after a punch from Superman?

        • “Ow”?

      • They already did that with a two part movie!

  17. Honestly speaking, the MOS sequel should be about Supes and not Bat, cos DC have just re-introduced Supes to the world again.

    Fundamentally, Superman VS. Batman is a flawed idea, because Superman is still an alien with super-human powers and Batman at the end of the day is still human. The only way for Batman to win is to figure out a way to get hold of krptonite. Otherwise Supes crushes everything…

    Seriously, well made film is a well made film. Who cares if Marvel Avengers has already bought heroes together to fight a common enemy? Why can’t DC do it?? It would be very cool if Brainiac was introduced as the common villain (the nantechnology/digital version) since most of the planet is run via computers these days…and then have Bat and Supes work in tandem. Or even better would be to introduce Darkseid…just like in the cartoons, and have Bat and supes work together…

  18. Interesting youtube clip I came across and plus the whole Keaton vs Bale Best Batman disagreement. Which Keaton is the best!

  19. Very excited for this film. Much more so than anything Marvel has on the docket. But I am still skeptical about how they will make a Batman that most fans are familiar with(not even necessarily the Nolan version) who will be able to compete physically with the Snyder (or any other) version of Superman. They are just worlds apart. I feel like this is a Job more suited for Bruce Wayne, which really makes me want Bale back as he was an excellent Wayne. I also feel that the DCCU is at a disadvantage in that it does not have a common factor which ties each movie, and character together, like Marvel had with S.H.I.E.L.D.

  20. What a terrible title for a theatrical human Batman/Superman movie. that’s a title for an animated Batman/Superman movie. let’s go with ‘World’s Finest’ from the comics

    • I like ‘World’s Finest’ too. It’s classy.
      Batman vs Superman reminds me too much of (kinda mindless) movies like Aliens vs Predators or King Kong vs Godzilla (they’re fun, but the titles make them feel like niche movies)

      Maybe, for brand recognition, they could go the sub-titled approach like
      ‘Man of Steel: World’s Finest’ or
      “Batman & Superman: World’s Finest”
      Then you have those characters’ names in the title, but most people will still refer to it as simply, ‘World’s Finest’

  21. Oh, why a VS. movie? I dont wanna be that guy, Im glad DC is finally taking the first steps towards making JL movie, but why a VS.? I dont wanna see these fight each other the whole movie, and I dont want them to hate each other the whole time, just for them to be somewhat antagonistic towards one another until they need to put aside their mistrust to team up and save the world. At most, if they have to butt heads, I hope it will be like Iron Man vs Thor, where they do it to tease the fans and immediately get back to the major conflict.

    • I agree i don’t want to come out of the movie and hear everyone argue who is better and i just cant imagine them fighting each other for a whole movie.The title is not great i would prefer worlds finest because it just sounds better.

  22. While this title is bland- It’s definitely- $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

  23. Not sure if this has been mentioned, but they can’t seriously be planning to have the two go toe-to-toe? Can they?

    Unless Kryptonite is involved, this is akin to me getting in the octagon with Anderson Silva. Granted I used to kick-box when I was in my 20s, but c’mon; I’d be running from Anderson crying like a little girl.

    Which is exactly what Batman would be doing without that green meteor rock! But then again, Bruce is bat-$#!% crazy.

    • He’s also not stupid or afraid.

      • I hope that wasn’t a rude insult. Like you’re inferring that I’m stupid and/or afraid.

        • Not at all, and I apologize if you took it that way.

          All I’m saying is Batman embraces fear and has the mind of Sherlock Holmes. Just because he’s human, doesn’t mean he is like any human we know.

          I’d run too. But I’m not Batman :)

          • Np. Sorry to sound defensive, but it is the Internet, where sadly, insults seem to be the norm.

            I know what you mean though, Batman is a different breed altogether. If there is a human smart or cunning enough to beat Supes, it would be him.

            The only problem I have is when you start to factor in everything that Supes has: the strength, heat vision, flight, super-speed, x-ray vision. It’s hard to imagine anything overcoming all that, which is why I loved Man of Steel. In MoS, he was facing a group of Kryptonians that were for the most part able to match his strength, speed, etc. Even the playing field, so to speak.

            I think when writers are often writing for Superman they often underestimate the power that the super-speed provides. When you think about having that strength while possessing that speed, it’s no wonder there’s none that can go toe-to-toe with Big Blue.

            Just my humble opinion.

            • Agreed.

              Superman, IMO, isn’t the most well thought out character. You have so many different writers make him weaker or stronger than what he originally was every time, and that’s why it sparks conflict with Batman fans.

              Batman is genius because he keeps his potential secret from everyone else. Therefore, he could walk out one day with a whole Batsuit made out of kryptonite and no one would ever see it coming. His strengths, weaknesses, intelligence, etc. All of that has been the same.

              I guess that’s why I like him more than Superman. I could pick up any Batman story and not question how he does things (except All-Star)

  24. Can’t lie, when I heard the announcement I got very very excited, even though I thought Man of Steel was only alright and certainly did not live up to my expectations. But just the idea of Supes and Bats on a screen together should get people, especially fan boys. Whether or not Snyder and co. will be able to pull it off is yet to be seen, but make no mistake I will absolutly be there on its release date. Having said that I’m really hoping WB/DC dust off that old script for this movie writen by Andrew Kevin Walker and just have Goyer adapt that into MOS’s universe because I’m losing faith in Goyer quickly, and AKW is the man.

  25. I would like to see the Mad Hatter and Victor Zsasz in a Batman movie as villians!

  26. HOW on gods green earth can Batman even give Superman a fight??

    What, is he gonna throw batarangs at Supes??
    Or use his MAD detective skills to buy some Kryptonite from lex luthor??
    CMON that is very lame!!
    I would much rather have a teamup… This is just like a Video Game I think I had!! JUST A STUPID IDEA.. And everyone says Marvel caters to the Kiddies??? this is some MAJOR CATERING

    As USUAL DC CAN GO KICK THEMSELVES IN THE BALLS! And to think I actually loved this idea 4 days ago…. LMAO I SHOULD HAVE KNOWN DC WOULD SCREW THE POOCH

    • Slow down this is just a rumor.

    • i know right if bane broke batman’s back just imagine what superman can do

      • Didn’t he do so in the comics also?

        • yeah bane broke batman’s back in the comics

  27. I would have preferred “worlds finest”

  28. U DC fanboys sure know how to b**** about something IMO they did focus on Clark and kal el a lot in MOS but at the end there’s a crash space ship in Metropolis a crater about the size of Central Park and evidence of Bruce and Lex existing…so with that to go off of I believe Superman will head the relief efforts and build metropolis up better than before this will bring people to trust him….until lex undermines that trust and only batman who figures out Clark’s identity can save his public image….so it’ll b supes vs (kryptonite weapons anyone?) Supes vs world supes vs lex but no supes vs bats so working title needs more work

  29. Just a quick question, bane beat the sh*t out of batman and superman could crush bane into a fine paste. As I’ve never read the comic in question, can someone fill me in on this one, I take it batman got his hands on some Kryptonite or something?? The Nolan batman was all about fear, shadows and kicking ass, only in dark knight did he display a little more of an intellectual side, even then joker had him on toast.

    • In short: Nolan’s Batman wouldn’t even last 10 minutes in a fight with the Michael Keaton Batman, it isn’t written and well thought out enough to respect the character. You can’t treat fiction as non-fiction at times, and that is a prime example IMO.

      • I don’t agree with you. I prefer Keaton’s depiction of Batman, but I don’t think that his Batman could beat Bale’s. the latter’s was trained in combat by the league of shadows.

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