‘The Avengers 2′ Script Doesn’t Include Loki, May Contain Science

Published 2 years ago by , Updated June 18th, 2013 at 8:36 am,

Tom Hiddleston as Loki in Thor1 The Avengers 2 Script Doesnt Include Loki, May Contain Science

If some of the fan backlash to this year’s biggest box office success so far, Iron Man 3, tells us anything, it’s that the villain of a movie is often just as important, if not more so, than the hero. After all, there’s not much point in having incredible powers if there aren’t any worthy opponents to use them against.

One of the most popular villains to emerge from the Marvel cinematic universe so far has been Loki, played by Tom Hiddleston, who was the main villain of both Thor and The Avengers and somehow managed to survive both movies in order to apparently become a reluctant ally in Thor: The Dark World.

Fans who were expecting further mischief and mayhem in The Avengers 2 may be disappointed to hear that they’ll have to do without the mischief. Joss Whedon appeared as a guest on last week’s Empire Film Podcast, and was asked about a specific moment in The Avengers when Loki delivers a searing speech to Black Widow that culminates in him calling her a “mewling quim,” Whedon firmly replied he wasn’t interested in repeating himself in the sequel:

“Imitating what I did before is the surest way to do it not as well. Second of all… Loki is not there to say those terrible things.”

This news could (and probably will) be taken as a hint that Loki will not survive the events of Thor: The Dark World, especially since, in the trailer, Thor promises to kill his adopted brother when Loki inevitably betrays him. This could also tie in to what we’ve heard about Thor: The Dark World being a story of redemption for Loki, and redemption stories have a habit of ending badly for the redeemed.

Joss Whedon Talks Marvel Consultant Role The Avengers 2 Script Doesnt Include Loki, May Contain Science

Within the context of the shared Marvel universe, however, there’s no reason to assume that Loki’s absence in The Avengers 2 is an inherent indication of his death in Thor: The Dark World. It would be near impossible for Whedon to include every main or supporting character from each of the movie universes that he’s going bringing together, and since Loki already had his chance in the spotlight as the villain of The Avengers, he may have simply been benched for the next team-up. Since elements from the Thor franchise were the most significant driving force behind the plot of The Avengers, it’s likely that the sequel will change things up with the introduction of Quicksilver and Scarlet Witch.

Whedon also indicates in the podcast that he doesn’t like to kill characters off lightly. When asked whether he has the same inclination towards torturing or killing off his characters as George R.R. Martin, author of the A Song of Ice and Fire book series upon which Game of Thrones is based, Whedon says that while he intends to “squeeze” the Avengers in the next film, he’s never had any particular urge to hurt or kill his characters:

“It’s why Buffy was the least frightening horror show ever, because I don’t find people to be expendable… I believe that my work exists for other reasons… I haven’t seen Game [of Thrones], so I don’t know how the way in which he does it. I’m just like, “Keep killing them. If you and Robert Kirkman can just carry the banner and let me rest, that would be great.”

Tony Stark holding the Tesseract in The Avengers The Avengers 2 Script Doesnt Include Loki, May Contain Science

Whedon was naturally on his guard about revealing specific plot details (he jokes that he’s taken to karate-chopping anyone who asks him questions about Quicksilver), but he did reveal one very slim sliver of a hint when asked about the fine-tuning that the script requires:

“There’s some science in it, which means I have scenes where someone says, ‘Science the sciencey science!’ And then I’m like, ‘I’ll fix that later.’”

Are you disappointed that Loki won’t be returning, or would you have been more disappointed if he had? Let us know your theories on what might happen in Thor: The Dark World and The Avengers 2 in the comments.


Thor: The Dark World is out in theaters on November 8, 2013, with The Avengers 2 following much later on May 1, 2015.

Source: Empire Online [via ComingSoon]

Follow H. Shaw-Williams on Twitter @HSW3K
Get our free email alerts on the topics and author of this article:


Post a Comment

GravatarWant to change your avatar?
Go to Gravatar.com and upload your own (we'll wait)!

 Rules: No profanity or personal attacks.
 Use a valid email address or risk being banned from commenting.

If your comment doesn't show up immediately, it may have been flagged for moderation. Please try refreshing the page first, then drop us a note and we'll retrieve it. Keep in mind that we do not allow external links in the comments.

  1. I know the worst villain Marvel could think of. He/ She goes by the name of Justin Beiber and has armies of Belieber at his disposal. His main powers are to irritate everyone, end their peace and push the heroes to their limits. And he/she uses SCIENCE (radio waves, TV waves) to spread his fear in the heart of every adult.

    • If they did that and our heroes won out it would seem just a touch too fantastical, just too unbelievable.

      • You mean unbelieberable

  2. Alright H. Shaw-Williams, I’m a fan of the site. I read up on film developments once a night. That said, you just wrote a story with a headline that says “May Contain Science.” Is that really worth putting in a headline or saying about a movie based on comic books? You might as well say that it “May Contain Plotpoints” or “May Contain Impossible Feats Of Speed And Strength” or maybe “May Contain Nuts.” What I’m getting at is that I laughed at your headline. Also, I’m obsessed with this sites obsession with movies.

    • Take your complaint to Josh Whedon.
      Read more than the title to the article.

      The title refers to the language used in the Whedon quote:
      “There’s some science in it, which means I have scenes where someone says, ‘Science the sciencey science!’ And then I’m like, ‘I’ll fix that later.’”

      • Hey bud,

        I did actually read the entire article. What I was getting at is that more often than not these articles report on developments that aren’t really developments. To me, it would have made more sense to say something like “Avengers 2 Script Still In Development.” I’m being extremely nit-picky here. I just thought it was a funny thing to read.

        Do you have Joss Whedon’s email address, I’d like to take this up with him. I have to great ideas about science that I think would be great for the the Marvels Extended Movie Universe(s) Phases 3-6 Cosmic Continuity 1(a).



        • Hey, nothing personal Dusty. Did not mean to sound that way.

          It sounded like you were tasking on the writer.
          Lots of Whedon fans on this site that crave
          anything he says or hints at so these
          kinds of articles are understandable.

          I am not one myself, but I get it.

          If I had Josh’s email I’d give it to you.
          When it comes to science he is not very
          “sciencey” and any ideas you have would help.

          • ^taking not tasking

  3. I think it’s a good idea to not keep bringing Loki back as the villain, although I would’ve liked there to be a small cameo, maybe a flashback.

    I’m looking forward to how he plans to bring the tension, as the last film was all about bringing the Avengers together, and he says he’s not planning to repeat himself.

    Whatever happens, I’m hoping it’ll end with the Avengers living at the Avengers Mansion like in the comics.

  4. Sorry to all of you who want and alien being to play the villain in A2… but from what I gather Whedon doesn’t want to repeat what he already did. That means no aliens for the villain. At least not until A3 when Thanos comes to town. Sadly I would love to see Mandarin and Fin Fang Foom

    • Mandarin and Fin Fang Foom? Really? This is the Avengers sequel, so you have to think bigger. I think Korvac would be ideal, since GOTG is the last movie before Avengers 2.

      • Oh, and don’t forget Ultron. Although, I don’t think Marvel would be able to properly set him up until Phase 3 since Ant-Man won’t come out until then.

      • Yeah Bro… 4 real! Doing some due-diligence I have unearthed an article b4 IM3 came out (mainly spoilers that hadn’t come to light until IM3 was released) which was fairly accurate about what would happen in IM3 and mentioned Mandarin’s survival of IM3 and returning in the future, “possibly for Avengers”. Just like Loki in Avengers (which I don’t believe Loki was ever an Avengers baddie but I could be wrong), Marvel needs an already established villain. So daydream all you want… Unless something drastic happens, Bet the farm Mandarin is gonna be the villain. No need to think bigger when you are correct

        • Oh not to mention the verifying by MARVEL studios of the return of the Extremis “threat”. This being verified… where else in the MARVEL movie vein would the Extremis storyline fit? Who was the mastermind behind it? Sorry but just like the creation of the universe… Something cannot come from nothing. Don’t believe MARVEL will gamble this movie and have a villain that the common moviegoer who knows nothing about MARVEL on a villain not introduced and expect it to succeed. I mean if that were the case, wouldn’t we be seeing The Mad Titan himself as the villain in A2? They are trying to show the moviegoers who he is and what he is about.

        • MANDARIN? Are you kidding me? LOL

    • Wrong, wrong, wrong. Thanos villian in A3? NO! Thanos will appear in GOTG and Avengers 2 will continue were that movie left off, leaving Thanos as the main villain in A2, not A3, maybe it was just a typo or error. Thanks.

      • What are you smoking when you read these article? Whedon has already said he is leaving Thanos for the finale. Say waht you want but you can’t argue with the facts… and I am just presenting them.

  5. Thanks for the spoiler.

  6. Well, we don’t know yet how Loki’s alignment will look like at the end of The Dark World. I doubt that he will die. They never killed off Loki (not permanently) in the comics either. They always brought him back, he either came back on his own or Thor brought him back, because he missed him.

    So yeah, I don’t mind that he skips Avengers 2. I think Loki will stay in the “reluctant ally” category at the end of The Dark World, still “grounded” in Asgard. He can come back for a different Marvel movie.

    Also, I think Tom Hiddleston signed up for like 6 movies. Considering his and Loki’s popularity, I doubt the new Thor film will be the last time we see him.

    Oh how about the Doctor Strange movie? It’s all about magic, Loki could be there. Plus something was in Odin’s vault that is linked to Strange, let’s not forget about that. They could link that movie to Asgard. In a magic movie like that even Amora could show up. Why not, is what I say.

    And when I say I want Loki to return, I’m not saying I want him back as the main villain again. He had plenty of supporting roles in comic story-lines, he doesn’t have to be the big bad of the movie all the time. That’s what is great about Loki, he has many different roles he can play.

    So yeah, there is a possibility of him dying, but I doubt it will happen.

    Or maybe he’s just gonna go Lady Loki for a bit if he does die.

  7. I have my bets placed on Loki returning BUT NOT AS A VILLAIN.

    Considering the fact Tom has a 5 or 6 movie contract, Im also guessing he doesn’t die.

  8. I’m sure this has been said already but I just barely read this article. But Joss doesn’t believe in killing his characters? Tell that to Wash. Oh wait Joss killed him!!! geez… Doesn’t believe in killing off characters my butt.

  9. I can say one thing; if Loki won’t be a part of The Avengers 2, I’m not gonna be watching the movie. He was my favourite character, close to Thor.

    • That seems like a stupid reason not to watch the movie. As a matter of fact, I find it hard to believe that you’ll be one of the only people in the civilized world NOT watching it.

      But, to each their own… I guess.

      • Agreed…sounds childish to say, “I’m not going to watch a particular movie because my favorite character is not in it”…./cry. Please kid, like you’re not going to watch A2, because of speculation, Loki might not be in it. Get over your man-crush and appreciate a franchise trying to evolve to appease the fans of the franchise. Thanks


        • I rather feel like it’s a childish thing to say to someone that their choices is not valid. If that is their favorite character and want to follow the character to its conclusion and nothing beyond that, and if that character is the only reason that they wanted to watch the film to begin with, they can choose to not be interested, not everyone is gonna be like you. Accept that.
          One can still appreciate something (the evolving franchise) without direct involvement. Are you saying that no one would ever losing interest in MCU due to the lack of a character they care about? If Ironman(or even RDJ for that matter) was not there would some of his character’s fans loss a bit of interest?

    • I’d be disappointed too without Loki. Loki is the only reason I got into the Marvel movies and comics.

    • Nobody tucking cares.

    • Nobody gives a s***.

  10. Why would actual fans of the franchise/marvel universe want to see Loki again anyways? Yes he’s sneaky. Yes he’s a good actor, and yes, he’s a good villian, but really, you want to see him again? HA! That’s a joke. The A2 movie would be a disaster if we saw Loki doing the same shenanigans as we saw in A1.

    Correct me if I’m wrong…

    Someone commented that Thanos would be the villian in A3? Am I missing something? Why would Thanos make an appearance in the mid-credit scene in A1 to be the villian in A3? He’s the villian in A2, No? But, please, please, please, no more Loki. The Hulk smashed him into the ground, and he did nothing afterwards except laying there waiting for the Avengers to win the fight, and then apprehend him. Grrrrrreat villian…..*sarcasm.

    • People think he might not be A2 villian because after him theres bassically no where to go, he’s the big baddie. Also Im pretty sure there have been articles/interviews/leaked sources sayinf Thanos is not gonna be A2 villian, but maybe one of his henchmen.

    • i think it have to do with something whedon said earlier, in a early interview when talked of Thanos he said something about wanting to save him for the big finale, so many people assumed that by big Finale he meant Avengers 3.

      • Saving him for the “Big Finale” in the third Avengers film would be, and is, a fantastic Idea.

        - Introducing him in “The Avengers” as a background villian.
        - Establishing him more as a background villian/handler of the main villian(s) in Guardians of the Galaxy, with ‘Death‘ at his side.
        - Bringing him in as a handler/background villian in The Avengers 2 more predominately, with his henchman doing his bidding in the film, either/or be one henchman+Crossbones OR, MoE.
        - Guardians of the Galaxy sequel (if made) may see him searching the Universe for The Infinity Guantlet/Cosmic Cube.
        - The Avengers in ‘The Avengers 3′ along-side Guardians of the Galaxy (note: James Gunn speaking of seeing Chris Pratt and RDJ buddying up/ RDJ having a run for his money with Chris Pratt at his side, and going all out with the battle sequece against Him.

        (with the roster consisting off, if not limited to: Star-Lord, Drax, Gaurma (sp?), Rocket Raccoon, Groot, Iron Man, Cap America, Thor, Ant-Man/Wasp, Doctor Strange, Black Panter, and The Hulk (maybe Black Widow/Hawkeye/Falcon/War Machine [Iron Patriot])

        A man can wish, can’t he?
        This seem like the apperiate thing to do under the circumstances.

        OR maybe they’ll probably introduce him as a the big baddie/finale in The Avengers 4, but, if RDJ is only signed for a 2 picture deal. It seems to reason that Thanos may, in fact be the big baddie for The Avengers 3.

        UNLESS: they introduce Ultron.
        Who Knows.

        • And then… they introduced Ultron

  11. All I have to say is… If Loki does not live then I don’t want to live.